View Full Version : Windows pre-order
Not sure about cheapest, this should help you decide between HP and Ultimate.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_7_editions#Comparison_chart
HP should be enough for most people, Pro for power users, Ultimate I can't see anyone but hardcore users needing.
... or people who need to work with foreign language versions of Windows (and I don't just mean writing the odd letter to a pen pal).
I've installed it on my main system here and all seems to be working fine, everything picked up and so that's good.
Now I've booted back into the main OS, stopped the Windows 7 drive from mounting at boot by tweaking my /etc/fstab file and I'm all ready with it there if I need it for anything :)
I'm surprised the XP Mode isn't in the HP version though.
£30 Win 7 Pro Student jobby all installed and functioning fantastically here :)
Seems great thus far, the real test will be when I'm running multiple-archi bits & pieces as well as undertaking other tasks :D
Thumbs up so far :)
Nope - it's Pro/Ultimate only. Presumably they figure that it'll be business customers who are most in need of XP mode. They're probably right.
Can't remember if there any Host/Guest restrictions for Windows 7. If there aren't, you can always DIY it with VirtualBox or somesuch.
Hmm, finding some problems. I have a couple of mst have programmes that would appear to be 16bit based - and they won't run on 64 bit windows. Hmm. Don't need them that often so wondering about dual booting a 32bit install.
But what I can't find is I can do that with one product key - it's the same computer after all :) Anyone know?
Ta :)
Retail keys work with both 32-bit and 64-bit.
I think I may have a few 16-bit apps too*. Won't know for sure until I take the plunge. I know some of the old products I worked on have 16-bit installers, but I haven't had to touch those in years so I should be safe at least with that.
* I've got an original DOS set of Norton Utilities, but most of them no longer work so those won't be a loss.
Yeah but can you install both versions on the same time with the same key? Or will it want me to buy it twice?
As long as it's on the same PC, I don't think that's a problem. Best read the EULA first though.
You may have to do telephone activation on the second install.
Matblack
26-10-2009, 13:11
Hmmmmm
I'm not sure what to do
I have Vista Home thingy edition at the moment and can upgrade for £30 to W7 Home Prem or Pro. Only thing I am slightly worried about is that I've had the PC blue screen on me twice in the last couple of days, its never done it before, the suggested solution was to run update which I did and it installed a new graphics driver so it might be that, not sure. Also Pro is a custom install where as Home Prem just goes over the top of the current installation, one is convenient, the other is tempting as I could probably do with a clean install :/
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I'd always recommend a clean install anyway if you can. You can't predict what baggage an upgrade is going to leave behind and besides there are several upgrade issues already.
NokkonWud
26-10-2009, 14:53
Mine STILL hasn't arrived. Grrr.
There are three different methods of using the upgrade to do a clean install here (http://www.winsupersite.com/win7/clean_install_upgrade_media.asp). Well worth a shufti.
Matblack
26-10-2009, 16:54
I've just ordered a new 1Tb HDD and what would be ideal for me is to be able to download the upgrade on my current drive and then install to the new HDD so I can boot from the original for a while if I want to (whilst I 'source' a few programs) but I suspect this won't be an option which is annoying :/
I suspect the best thing to do in that case is to burn an ISO and then disconect the original HD and use the ISO to install W7 on the new drive for a shiny new system but I suspect this will be an issue too as I'll probably have to put Vista on first to get that to work :/
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Briggykins
26-10-2009, 16:58
Yeah I have to say this upgrade install thing is rather annoying. It's installed well enough and is dual booting happily with Vista, but it's installed on the F:\ drive which really annoys me for some reason. Also I didn't want to dual boot with Vista.
Think I'll probably be wiping the HD, installing a clean copy of Vista then upgrading immediately to 7. Quite impressed with 7 so far though, going to take a bit of getting used to but it's got some clever tricks.
Matblack
26-10-2009, 17:01
Yeah I have to say this upgrade install thing is rather annoying. It's installed well enough and is dual booting happily with Vista, but it's installed on the F:\ drive which really annoys me for some reason. Also I didn't want to dual boot with Vista.
Think I'll probably be wiping the HD, installing a clean copy of Vista then upgrading immediately to 7. Quite impressed with 7 so far though, going to take a bit of getting used to but it's got some clever tricks.
Hang on, is this dual booting on a seperate partition or a seperate drive?
If its a seperate drive this could be what I'm looking for as long as it would continued to work after I removed the Vista drive :)
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Installing two versions of Windows alongside each other can have a few gotchas...
If you want to clean install one version of Windows over another, the best thing to do is to use the 'advanced' options (just after the EULA I think), to reformat the partition. Windows setup should then see it as a fresh install and not try to do anything clever.
Beware installing Windows 7 on a second disk (or even a second partition) alongside another copy of Windows if you later intend to remove the original copy. Chances are Windows 7 will rely on the other copy to boot. This was sometimes fixable with the recovery console on XP - I'm not sure if Windows 7 has something similar.
MB, you don't have to put Vista on first. Worst you'll have to do is Install Windows 7 twice. See Feek's post.
LeperousDust
26-10-2009, 17:12
You can use any upgrade disc to do a full isntall (its called custom and then theres some trickery afterwards).
http://www.downloadsquad.com/2009/10/23/save-80-on-your-windows-7-purchase-the-upgrade-does-full-inst/
You can install W7 anywhere you want including another drive from the advance partition manager menu. If you dual boot with XP/Vista as well then remove the original OS you'll screw the bootloader, but if you load the W7 disc and run its recovery mode i think it should quite happily fix everything for you :)
http://neosmart.net/wiki/display/EBCD/Recovering+the+Vista+Bootloader+from+the+DVD
Any more questions?
Im currently running W7 fine on my little dell mini 10, very very very impressed with it! Havent activated yet since MS managed to forget to send me a serial key, but hey ho they'll reply eventually and all will be well :)
For more random windows 7 stuff read these.
http://lifehacker.com/5390086/the-master-list-of-new-windows-7-shortcuts
http://lifehacker.com/5386953/lifehackers-complete-guide-to-windows-7
http://lifehacker.com/5388948/top-10-windows-7-booster-apps
Im currently trying panda anti virus although im not sure if im going to stay with it yet, seems to fit in very well with the netbook W7 theme though...
Matblack
26-10-2009, 17:34
In that case I think I will wait till the new disk arrives tomorrow and just do a clean install off an ISO I can create from the upgrade download then I'll dual boot by switching between drives in the BIOS until I have all the software I need installed on W7, then the old 500Mb can be a storage drive for unimportant things like films :)
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Briggykins
26-10-2009, 18:02
Tis another drive...seemed to work okay. The trouble with all the 'clean install with upgrade' guides is that they relate to the DVD and not the download. Still, will stick with this for now and see how it goeths.
NokkonWud
26-10-2009, 19:03
Turned up later today, but not with normal post. Makes me think it was left with a neighbour without a card and then posted through the letterbox by them.
Installed and running now. Crikey it's quick! And oh, so pretty.
LeperousDust
26-10-2009, 20:21
Tis another drive...seemed to work okay. The trouble with all the 'clean install with upgrade' guides is that they relate to the DVD and not the download. Still, will stick with this for now and see how it goeths.
I did it with my student download copy all works fine, i just extracted it and put it straight to a usb stick didnt even bother making an iso of it :)
Well i have to say I'm REALLY impressed with Windows 7. I've had NO conflicts, NO driver issues, NO program issues even though it's the 64bit version, it's fast, it's pretty, and it just works - very well.
Wow, I can't believe I said that about a M$ product!!! :eek:
Same here Will, I had so many issues with my hardware on Vista and yet NOTHING at all on Win 7 Pro 64. :smug:
Nada, nowt, squat, diddley, nothing.
:woot:
NokkonWud
27-10-2009, 02:43
Odd, I got three from Play.com (one for me, and one each for two of my friends). I installed mine perfectly and it's absolutely fantastic.
My friend also had no issues at all installing his, it went through perfectly, however, when he's gone to go and authorize his copy it hits him with an error claiming that his key isn't genuine or that it's already been used, this is after 3 completely different attempts at entering it. He's very computer literate so it won't be anything stupid, but it's obviously a little frustrating for him.
Anyone heard anything else like this happening to anyone?
Just phone M$ and as long as you have a PoP you'll be fine. :)
NokkonWud
27-10-2009, 13:12
Yeah, phone activation worked perfect for him. Obviously not ideal, but not too bad.
Briggykins
27-10-2009, 16:56
I did it with my student download copy all works fine, i just extracted it and put it straight to a usb stick didnt even bother making an iso of it :)
Ah, I didn't try that as I didn't think the folder it created would be bootable, although looking at it now there's a bootmgr and everything in there. Now just to find a USB stick big enough :)
LeperousDust
27-10-2009, 19:17
Well not *that* easy, but almost, you need to use wintoflash with the expanded setup folder :)
http://wintoflash.com/home/en/
Getting BSOD on the new build I installed it to on Sunday :(
Completely new rig built from the following:
i5 750
Gigabyte GA-P55-UD3
Artic Cooling Freezer 7 Pro V2
G.Skill Ripjaw 4GB
500GB Samsung F3
1GB XFX HD5850
Samsung SH-S223B DVD-/+RW
Dell UltraSharp 2209WA 22" Widescreen LCD
Corsair TX 650W
BSOD are coming from after I installed the ATI Catalyst™ 9.10 Suite for Windows 7 (64 bit) (http://game.amd.com/us-en/drivers_catalyst.aspx?p=win7/windows-7-64bit)
Don't think I can do 64-bit Minidumps, otherwise I'd offer to diagnose the problem for you. Without more info on that front it's just guesswork. :(
Don't think I can do 64-bit Minidumps, otherwise I'd offer to diagnose the problem for you. Without more info on that front it's just guesswork. :(
I'll have to make a note of the BSOD as I can't get into W7 in normal mode.
The new fangled restore tools that run off the 100mb partition seem be unable to fix the problem.
Since there isn't anything on the HDD other than the borked W7 install, the only thing I have to loose in a fresh format and install is time.
If I continue to get BSOD when I have another go then it's probably pointing towards a hardware fault (wouldn't know where to start first :().
LeperousDust
28-10-2009, 01:32
Out of interest whats everyones power settings when it comes to laptops? Windows 7 gives you a whole lot of choice! I personally feel things need fine tuning a little, need to make sure i can squeeze the most out of my battery for certain occasions in "power saver", yet make sure the computer is able to rinse the battery and not sleep or hibernate so quickly (for film watching etc...) in "High Performance". Even more annyoing is trying to find a balance for the balanced power setting, one that i will most often be leaving it on.
I'm trying to work out how long is sensible before i switch my screen off, or hard drives or hibernate and what certain things want scaling back on a day to day basis. Theres so much to choose from and so much to think about i havent quite worked out exactly myself yet, but i'm gonna look into it the next fews days :)
I wouldn't mind a battery meter like the one that comes default with ubuntu either :)
All down to personal preference. For example even in high performance on my laptop I limit the CPU to a maximum of 80% (or so). That's to stop it getting rather too hot mind. ;D
Limiting CPU speed and turning the brightness down will help most under "power saver". Disk spin down is only useful if you can keep the disk idle, which I rarely find is possible for very long (spinning the disk back up wipes out the saving). Obviously disable stuff you don't need (do you need the network card enabled on battery power, for example).
PS - this is all based on Vista, but Windows 7 isn't that different IIRC.
LeperousDust
28-10-2009, 02:19
Yeah they're very similar, i love the options but i can never make my mind up! ;D Also i'm unsure at what real impact having wireless is minimum power saving or maximum performace really does in the real world etc...
As Mark said, it looks like the checker is a bit poo. On Windows 7 now :cool: and it looks like it works on mine out the box :)
Did a quick WIE on the fresh install:
Processor: 6.1
RAM 6.1
Aero Graphics 6.8
Gaming Graphics 6.8
HDD 5.2 (not a suprise, the drive I'm trying is ancient!)
Basic spec is Dual core 2.6 with 4gb 1600 DDR3 and a Radeon HD4670 512mb GDDR3.
edit: after installing all available updates, no change to the score.
Hmm, dissapointing, I've done a clean install using my 1TB SATAII drive and that score has only gone up to 5.9 - what are others getting?
I'm getting
Processor 7.3
RAM 7.3
Graphics Aero 6.8
Graphics Gaming 6.8
HDD 5.9
Not really fussed about the numbers to be honest, I'm yet to find anything my machine struggles with so I'm perfectly happy :)
You'll probably only break 6 in a stripe setup I imagine, or maybe a quick ssd. My striped disks are 5.9 in Vista, but I'm switching it to Linux shortly so I'll never find out what 7 would have given it :)
I'm surprised the XP Mode isn't in the HP version though.
It has xp compatibility. What pro/ultimate has is XP virtual machine. Which home users wouldn't use anyway.
As long as it's on the same PC, I don't think that's a problem. Best read the EULA first though.
You may have to do telephone activation on the second install.
From the EULA:
Alternative Versions. The software may include more than one version, such as 32-bit and 64-bit. You may install and use only one version at one time.
Doesn't sound hopeful :( About to give it a try!
edit: Ooh, seems to work!
Sounds like a good deal to me. Is that open to the unwashed masses? :)
As for the upgrade option. Yes, absolutely you can. Microsoft had to leave that option open because it is perfectly legitimate - by Microsoft's own statements - to upgrade Any genuine version of Windows 2000, XP, or Vista to Windows 7.
You might have to jump through a few hoops though - link (http://www.winsupersite.com/win7/clean_install_upgrade_media.asp) (courtesy Feek).
LeperousDust
04-11-2009, 05:56
Im using the student upgrade version which for what i can tell is exactly the same as the others. Installing fresh is **** easy and it activated and everything works swimmingly. No need to install twice no need to really fart around at all barely. Definitely get the upgrade :)
OMG, installed and up and running in less than 60 mins, i haven't installed most of my programs yet but i am online, got my bookmarks and can access ALL my old photo and data. BRILLIANT !!!
Oooo this is different ...
Just finally kicked off the install on the server as I have never had the time before. Quite impressed so far, no raid drivers needed for the install and very easy to kick off the build.
Eventually I will cross my main machine over as xp is getting clunky now (and reinstalling takes ages and pee's me off in xp).
Still haven't got around to upgrading any of my systems, as they're not broken and priorities got in the way, so all four licenses are still sealed up. Might do the upgrade for my parents (fifth license I bought) over the holidays.
Briggykins
18-12-2009, 20:52
Took me more getting used to than Vista, mainly because of all the taskbar changes, but now I'm there I'm loving it. Seems much more efficient and responsive.
I haven't noticed any issues yet. One thing I am really impressed with is being able to pull down all the drivers automatically. It took under an hour to rebuild my server inc installing AV/firewall and pull down drivers for all the cards. It's now sitting there ready to stream media content from.
I now may go and start messing around with hyperspin for when it becomes the master server under the stairs. It will then act as a media centre with the ability to play loads of old roms :cool:
The reason I loathe reinstalling xp is because of all the drivers you have to install to get it working properly. Granted you could slipstream these onto a win xp cd but it's still a pain in the backside. To give you an idea, I had set aside the entire evening to get this setup based on past experiences ..... impressed so far.
I know what you mean about XP. AHCI/RAID drivers are the biggest pain in the backside of them all. I had to slipstream XP to fix that one.
Ultimate wasn't an option on the original offers - it was Home or Pro only. I'm not sure if there was a more recent offer that included Ultimate and I'm also not sure if there were any upgrade offers.
£58 doesn't seem like a bad deal if you need Ultimate, but it's worth checking first as most people don't.
That's one of the few cases where it makes sense. :)
The original offers were both retail, with Home at ~£45 and Pro at ~£85. I got 'in' on those so never looked at the possibility of any upgrade offers. The other option would be an unused upgrade voucher, but I'd expect they'd be like gold dust now - there are plenty more reasons to upgrade than there are to stick with Vista.
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