View Full Version : Do you consider yourself to be fairly open minded?
I shot my first wedding on Friday, it was a friends niece Kerry, and her partner Emma. When I told people about it, I was met with shocked faces, and unnecessary comments such as, "Oh! A dyke wedding!" :confused:
I cant understand why this is such a big deal, even though its fairly commonplace now, or is it? I have no problem with this whatsoever, otherwise I wouldn't have agreed to do it.
I went to buy them a card, and found cards bearing "Mrs and Mrs", "To our daughter and her girlfriend" etc etc...
The times they are a changing, but how many people here still have an old fashioned view? What are your views on this? :)
Chuckles
20-07-2008, 16:39
I for one am fully in favour of girl on girl relationships.
In fact, I would encourage more of them ;)
You just want to see the results on video though. :p
I'm open-minded on some things, firmly closed-minded on others. This sort of thing wouldn't bother me in the slightest though.
Doesn't bother me in the slightest, but I'd say I'm fairly open minded with many things.
SidewinderINC
20-07-2008, 16:43
Each to their own, as long as it doesn't affect my life.
Don't think too many people would be that shocked as especially where I am now (Brighton!) really wouldn't bother me.
I know who my head bridesmaid would be and he's gay wonder what he would say about me putting him in a dress :D lol
BB x
*not fussed* :)
Though I did go to an all girls school, so these things don't seem "different" to me. It's just the norm.
Doesn't bother me, went to a reception for a colleagues gay wedding and had a blast.
Justsomebloke
20-07-2008, 17:11
I am giving my Gay little Sister away at her wedding next August :cool:
Answer to your Question.
Yes I consider myself open minded.
It's disgusting and should be banned.
Outraged of Banbury.
Actually, I couldn't give a toss.
It depends what view point you see things. Love is a great thing, and the more love in the world the better, and if there are 2 people in love with each other then that's awesome. However there is the view point that in spite of evolution and development of modern society, some things are a little hard to accept since to some people it's not "natural"... yet love is "natural"... so it's a bit of an oxymoron. I flit between both extremes, for example from a cultural and life experience and view on the world I'd say that I'm very fortunate to have the ability to be educated in my decision to be more open minded than most. However, there's a bit of a "backward" mentality, going back to somewhere (where I don't know) thinking it's "odd". I'm not going to deny it.
However, I don't have strong feelings about it at all. I'm very much ambivalent towards it, though edging to the "couldn't care less" side of things in general.
I think what I'm trying to say is that I can understand arguments on both sides, but could never totally agree with either of them exclusively. Just like I could never be left wing or right wing in politics, or anti/pro religion etc... For me they all work, all the combinations are as true as each other.
The immature side of me goes, "cool 2 women hehehehehehe", but just as quickly I go "awww it's great that they have each other"...
So after that long winded brain dump, I don't really mind, if it doesn't affect me directly why should it bother me?
Dymetrie
20-07-2008, 17:38
It depends what view point you see things. Love is a great thing, and the more love in the world the better, and if there are 2 people in love with each other then that's awesome. However there is the view point that in spite of evolution and development of modern society, some things are a little hard to accept since to some people it's not "natural"... yet love is "natural"... so it's a bit of an oxymoron. I flit between both extremes, for example from a cultural and life experience and view on the world I'd say that I'm very fortunate to have the ability to be educated in my decision to be more open minded than most. However, there's a bit of a "backward" mentality, going back to somewhere (where I don't know) thinking it's "odd". I'm not going to deny it.
However, I don't have strong feelings about it at all. I'm very much ambivalent towards it, though edging to the "couldn't care less" side of things in general.
I think what I'm trying to say is that I can understand arguments on both sides, but could never totally agree with either of them exclusively. Just like I could never be left wing or right wing in politics, or anti/pro religion etc... For me they all work, all the combinations are as true as each other.
The immature side of me goes, "cool 2 women hehehehehehe", but just as quickly I go "awww it's great that they have each other"...
So after that long winded brain dump, I don't really mind, if it doesn't affect me directly why should it bother me?
Translation:
"I don't understand it, but it doesn't bother me."
:p
Pretty much how I feel, just because I don't understand something doesn't mean it's wrong (other than people playing World of Warcraft, that's just unnatural!).
TinkerBell
20-07-2008, 18:50
I am very open minded :) I have a good friend who is a lesbian, and I fully support her as if it was anyone else. I know people who can't stand the idea though and think it is disgusting! Which is why she hasn't told many people about her sexuality which I think is a shame but I completely understand.
I really wish people would open their eyes and see the world as it is today and accept it.
http://www.flashasylum.com/db/files/Comics/Kris/rainbow.png
:D
Nice to know people here are embracing it, for use of a better term :D
TinkerBell
20-07-2008, 18:59
Haha! I love that :D
Knipples
20-07-2008, 19:01
My best mates brother is gay, and to be honest I knew he was a long time before he admitted it to his family. Hes living with his bloke, they have a house together and have been together for about 4 years now.
The only problem I have is with other people really, most people (especially men) when you hear someone is a lesbian its like "cooooooool" (in a rude way :D ) but when its two men theres quite a bit of this whole "Yuck" thing, and that its disgusting. Even the same person saying lesbians are fine by him is then saying that two men together is wrong. To me it doesnt make any difference.
Just me two penceworth....
I couldn't care less really. I've got some very close friends (both male and female) who are gay and if they're happy then I'm happy for them.
I'm certainly not paranoid enough to put my back to the wall everytime I meet a gay man.
I couldn't care less really. I've got some very close friends (both male and female) who are gay and if they're happy then I'm happy for them.
I'm certainly not paranoid enough to put my back to the wall everytime I meet a gay man.
Don't I know it!!!! :evil: :****er: :cool:
Del Lardo
20-07-2008, 21:33
My cousin is a lesbian and living with her partner and if she decided to get married then I'd be as happy for her as if she was marrying a chap.
My mothers side of the family is very Christian and the only person who has a problem is my mother who freely admits that while she is happy for my cousin she is unconfortable with her choice of partner as it goes against her beliefs.
The funny thing is that my mother and aunt have decided not to tell my grandparents (my cousin hasn't been given a choice in the matter!) as they don't think they can handle it. My grandparents blantantly know (only my aunt and mother can't see this) and as far are they are concerned my cousins happyness is far more important than what they believe.
TinkerBell
20-07-2008, 21:34
as far are they are concerned my cousins happyness is far more important than what they believe.
This is exactly how it should be with everybody to be honest :)
Flibster
20-07-2008, 21:36
I I've got some very close friends (both male and female)
Thats an entirely different issue... ;)
Same sex wedding don't bother me. Sadly the lesbians down the hall moved out and into a house - they were great fun to be around. Their other gay mates we equally fun. Used to work with a Bi woman called 'Wench'.
Really donesn't bother me at all.
Thats an entirely different issue... ;)
Same sex wedding don't bother me. Sadly the lesbians down the hall moved out and into a house - they were great fun to be around. Their other gay mates we equally fun. Used to work with a Bi woman called 'Wench'.
Really donesn't bother me at all.
Don't judge us all by your standards, Simon. You don't have photographic evidence of me kissing a man. Unlike a picture I have of you :)
Same sex or bisexuality is a none issue for me. One bi friend always gets accused of being greedy because he can't decide what gender he wants to go for.
Flibster
20-07-2008, 21:45
Don't judge us all by your standards, Simon. You don't have photographic evidence of me kissing a man. Unlike a picture I have of you :)
Ooooh... we can sort that out sweetie. :x
Kell_ee001
20-07-2008, 22:32
Doesn't bother me :)
I don't give a monkeys, if they are happy then that all that matters
This kind of thing annoys me in a way. It just doesnt register on my radar...I don't think of straight people in terms of their sexuality and likewise with anyone else. It's no different to me than a bloke who likes women with a big bum, or a women who likes skinny men.
I cant really put how I feel across...grrr! :)
This kind of thing annoys me in a way. It just doesnt register on my radar...I don't think of straight people in terms of their sexuality and likewise with anyone else. It's no different to me than a bloke who likes women with a big bum, or a women who likes skinny men.
I cant really put how I feel across...grrr! :)
I know what you mean I think :) The ideal situation is when no one even notices it's two women getting married, or two men. It's simply 2 people getting married.
Davey_Pitch
21-07-2008, 02:26
It's simply 2 people getting married.
Quoted as it sums up my thoughts perfectly. If they're happy, that's all that matters IMO.
Hmm.. hopefully this'll come across without being offensive., apologies if I do offend anyone, it's certainly not intentional. I'm just trying to be as honest as I can.
I consider myself to be fairly open minded and liberal in my attitudes, I do not support homosexual relationships in any way. It is my quite firm belief that it is contrary to my faith and against God's design of Man & Woman. To quote a common cliche amongst church circles, "It's Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve". However I don't let that impact my approach to or friendships with homosexuals. Shunning people due to differing opinions on life is the height of idiocy, and intolerence causes more wars and violence than almost anything else. I find the "anti-gay" protests to be extremely stupid that others of my faith seem to feel are worthwhile. When has persecution ever successfully had a positive impact on changing people's attitudes to your favour? Shoving a placard saying "You're going to burn in hell!" into their faces is hardly going to cause a mass conversion. One thing that irks me in a number of supposedly "liberal" men is the sheer arrogance that some display by being possessed of the idea that because someone is gay they're going to develop a crush on them. I mean, seriously, get over yourself!.
There are a number of things I don't approve of that the general population see as perfectly acceptable, some of which BD peeps do too, for example I'm firmly against co-habitation, which I consider to be against God's will. "Living in sin" as it's long been referred too. Hopefully I've never treated those of you who have chosen to do so any diferrently to those who are married. My fond hope is to be living to the philosophy of "Love the sinner, not the sin", and I do love everyone I've met on here. I try to be as open minded as possible and try to ensure that my personal biases do not impact on the support and friendship I offer, though of course it will always impact on any advise I offer when anyone asks me for some.
I hope that hasn't come across arrogantly, or seems "Holier than thou" Lord knows I'm far, far off the mark in my life, and I've made some monumental screw ups in the past some of which have affected BD peeps, they'll know who they are, for which I'll probably regret for a long time to come.
It doesn't bother me and I have been to a same-sex wedding about 5 years ago.
semi-pro waster
21-07-2008, 07:39
It doesn't really bother me either way although I'd admit a gay wedding might still be enough for a comment from me, mainly because I've not been to one (yet) and therefore like most first experiences it would probably merit some sort of discussion.
I'm not entirely sure why some people (guys usually) get upset if they are have someone of the same sex fancy them, it doesn't reflect on their mascul/feminity, if anything it should be a compliment - hey, if nothing else at least you've got options.
The only problem I have is with other people really, most people (especially men) when you hear someone is a lesbian its like "cooooooool" (in a rude way :D ) but when its two men theres quite a bit of this whole "Yuck" thing, and that its disgusting. Even the same person saying lesbians are fine by him is then saying that two men together is wrong. To me it doesnt make any difference.
Just me two penceworth....
I'm with you here lil lady too! I just don't get it!
I used to hang out with a bunch of gay blokes at uni - I absolutely adored them. So hilarious. There was a couple amidst this group too who would snog all the time and be lovey dovey and it was just completely normal... but out and about... the amount of times they were sneered at for just holding hands/arms around each other/giving each other a peck on the lips (they'd never full on snog in public)... it just made my blood boil. Oh yeh and one time, two girls I kind of knew snogged eachothers faces off in front of us and a load of blokes and they were all cooed and *phwoared* at by the random bunch. They jokingly said to my gay guy friends "now if that doesn't turn you straight then nothing will" and my gay friends laughed and said "not my kind of thing hunny, I like a good bit of meat" and slapped a friends bum. Instantly the other guys turned nasty and started shouting "GAYERS" and things I'm just not going to repeat. I was *flabbergasted*. They were trying to start a fight and everything. I didn't realise how rude and ignorant people can be. I didn't stay on at uni but I found out that a few months after I left one of them got beaten up quite badly for being a "gay boy" by some townies. I was so upset at this. He is *such* a lovely guy. Probably one of the nicest caring guys I have ever met. Really completely and entirely undeserved.
Grrr.
I think the reason why it's still "phwoar'ed" at (for 2 girls) and "eeewwww'ed" at (for 2 guys) is because it's still not accepted. For the majority of people it is weird. Remember from our history we have all come from at some point a strong religious background whether we like it or not. I don't have beliefs anywhere near as strong as Garp's but I completely understand and sympathise with his thoughts. Hypocritically, in spite of my concurrence I don't mind the co-habiting thing, but that's the duality or duplicity of my beliefs.
It's still tabboo just like anal sex is still considered a little "risque". Unfortunately we've become more prudish than we were half a century ago during the sexual revolution. This is not necessarily a bad thing as losing sight of ourselves is not good either. However we have become more intollerant as a nation. Whether or not it's just the UK or globally I don't know. In some parts of the world as we know homosexuality is illegal which is a shame, but then again their laws and beliefs are very much driven by religion - and whilst oppression is wrong, some control is required in this world to prevent anarchy. I'm not defending it either way.
I think we all have gay/lesbian friends here, well most of us do anyway, I have to say that I've always got on really well with my gay friends (which I used to be worried about - silly I know) but maybe that's why I had more female friends at uni... dunno. Anyway my point is, they are just people like you and me, and they just happen to be attracted by people who happen to be of the same sex. It's not a big deal really. You don't have to think too graphically about it as that's what some people I think get fixated about.
I can understand why blokes would find 2 girls all over each other exciting, but I have a question... do girls find 2 guys all over each other exciting? Do you understand why guys like seeing 2 girls all over each other?
Stan_Lite
21-07-2008, 08:51
This kind of thing annoys me in a way. It just doesnt register on my radar...I don't think of straight people in terms of their sexuality and likewise with anyone else. It's no different to me than a bloke who likes women with a big bum, or a women who likes skinny men.
I cant really put how I feel across...grrr! :)
I know what you mean I think :) The ideal situation is when no one even notices it's two women getting married, or two men. It's simply 2 people getting married.
Jen's right. Ideally, homosexual relationships including gay weddings wouldn't merit special consideration. Perhaps sometime in the future when these weddings are commonplace, less of an issue will be made of them but for the moment, they are still relatively uncommon and there are a variety of different attitudes to homosexuality and, as such, will draw comments from many angles.
Hmm.. hopefully this'll come across without being offensive., apologies if I do offend anyone, it's certainly not intentional. I'm just trying to be as honest as I can.
I consider myself to be fairly open minded and liberal in my attitudes, I do not support homosexual relationships in any way. It is my quite firm belief that it is contrary to my faith and against God's design of Man & Woman. To quote a common cliche amongst church circles, "It's Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve". However I don't let that impact my approach to or friendships with homosexuals. Shunning people due to differing opinions on life is the height of idiocy, and intolerence causes more wars and violence than almost anything else. I find the "anti-gay" protests to be extremely stupid that others of my faith seem to feel are worthwhile. When has persecution ever successfully had a positive impact on changing people's attitudes to your favour? Shoving a placard saying "You're going to burn in hell!" into their faces is hardly going to cause a mass conversion. One thing that irks me in a number of supposedly "liberal" men is the sheer arrogance that some display by being possessed of the idea that because someone is gay they're going to develop a crush on them. I mean, seriously, get over yourself!.
There are a number of things I don't approve of that the general population see as perfectly acceptable, some of which BD peeps do too, for example I'm firmly against co-habitation, which I consider to be against God's will. "Living in sin" as it's long been referred too. Hopefully I've never treated those of you who have chosen to do so any diferrently to those who are married. My fond hope is to be living to the philosophy of "Love the sinner, not the sin", and I do love everyone I've met on here. I try to be as open minded as possible and try to ensure that my personal biases do not impact on the support and friendship I offer, though of course it will always impact on any advise I offer when anyone asks me for some.
I hope that hasn't come across arrogantly, or seems "Holier than thou" Lord knows I'm far, far off the mark in my life, and I've made some monumental screw ups in the past some of which have affected BD peeps, they'll know who they are, for which I'll probably regret for a long time to come.
Not offensive in the slightest mate :)
Your faith is well known to us regulars and it's no secret what the christian view of homosexuality is. It's actually quite refreshing to hear a committed christian like yourself with such a tolerant attitude to the subject. One hears plenty of "fire and brimstone" type speeches, which always make me sad. If only more people had your tolerant and forgiving attitude, people might get on a bit better.
Having never been to one of these ceremonies, it's hard to say exactly how I feel on the subject but I've always been fairly liberal and would like to think I'd enjoy it as much as a straight wedding.
Shetland, where I was born and brought up, is rife with homophobia so there are very few openly gay couples on the islands - the only two couples I knew personally were lesbian couples. This seems to be more easily tolerated - presumably for reasons already alluded to in this thread.
Snuggle Ferret
21-07-2008, 09:16
It doesn't bother me and I have been to a same-sex wedding about 5 years ago.
What Tak said and I was there as well; t'was a blast :-)
Chuckles
21-07-2008, 10:46
To quote a common cliche amongst church circles, "It's Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve".
Do you believe it that according to the Genesis that non-sexual friendship between a man and a woman is acceptable? After all, it doesn't explicitely mention it in the same way that it doesn't mention homosexual relationships. Why automatically assume it is a sin?
Do you believe it that according to the Genesis that non-sexual friendship between a man and a woman is acceptable? After all, it doesn't explicitely mention it in the same way that it doesn't mention homosexual relationships. Why automatically assume it is a sin?
The old testament does explicitly mention about it being a sin for (if I remember the wording correctly) a "man to lie with man as he does with woman" or wordage along those lines. IIRC it makes no reference to it being wrong for a man and a woman to have a non-sexual friendship. If it does I've failed to notice when I've read through it, and missed any teaching relating to it.
Chuckles
21-07-2008, 11:10
The Old Testimony also states that a menstruating woman is unclean, should be shunned for 7 days and give 2 pigeons and 2 turtles to the priest after she finishes to slaughter.
I'm completely open-minded about it. Sexuality doesn't define the person, it's just one facet of their being. There's plenty more important things to judge a person by.
it does not, cannot and will never have an effect on me or my life. ergo, they can do what they want.
but i'm captain open minded
The Old Testimony also states that a menstruating woman is unclean, should be shunned for 7 days and give 2 pigeons and 2 turtles to the priest after she finishes to slaughter.
What?!? ROFL ;D
Yup all good with me :p People loving each other can only be a good thing, and more kudos to them if they do it willingly in the face of possible disapproval. I don't really see it any different to other things that are slightly 'unusual' in society, as an example like a man dating a woman who is a few years older is seen as a bit unusual..but really does it matter in the grand scheme of things? I think not at all, if two people are in a happy, loving relationship then what more is needed?
As mentioned before, sexuality is just another facet, and if a gay person cracks on to me (happened a few times, lol) it's just a compliment, no need to get defensive just a "sorry mate, I like girls!" usually does the trick, although some will have a good go at convincing me to 'have a try', haha! :) All good fun though :)
Chuckles
21-07-2008, 12:29
What?!? ROFL ;D
Leviticus:15 ;D
starscream: I'll try and give an in depth answer tonight, but the short answer is it relates to the difference between Old Law (before Jesus) and the New Law (Jesus), which replaces all the old law. It's a bit more complicated than that though..
Matblack
21-07-2008, 15:51
Spent some time at the Lovebox festival with our gay friends at the weekend, they are two of the nicest people I know and if them being with each other makes them happy than I'm delighted for them. I have no issues with people disaproving of other people lifestyles as long as they respect their right to do what makes them happy, people who openly insult or "gay bash" are scum and deserve to have their relationships subjected to the same kind of stress.
As for what the bible says, it strikes me that given recent events in the church (trouble at the Lambeth conference I suspect) the professionals don't even know how to translate 'God's word' so how laymen can condemn people based on their own translation is a bit of a mystery. :/
MB
semi-pro waster
21-07-2008, 17:47
As for what the bible says, it strikes me that given recent events in the church (trouble at the Lambeth conference I suspect) the professionals don't even know how to translate 'God's word' so how laymen can condemn people based on their own translation is a bit of a mystery. :/
MB
Probably (and please forgive the huge generalisation) because those who would condemn someones lifestyle for being different to their own also aren't the type to actually check their facts fully or consider that there could be a legitimate alternative.
An apposite quote from Bertrand Russell - "The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.".
Incidentally this thread is banned at work with a page score of >500 - does that constitute homophobia? ;D
Do I personally think it's wrong? Yes. Do I feel disgusted or offended by same sex relationships? No. Do I think homosexuals are somehow ill/abnormal/confused/etc? No.
I have no problem with same sex relationships and marriages. It's like fishing - I don't understand it :)
Justsomebloke
21-07-2008, 19:20
Some Interesting points of view been posted & some surprising ones.
Personally I think growing up in London helped me accept people for what they are rather than be judgemental.
When I was 18 the Best club in Europe was Heaven a Gay club that I used to go regularly on Friday nights. Being over 6ft & Extremely good looking (;D) I Always got propositioned & it never bothered me once. One of my best mates brothers is camper than Danny LaRue & I worked with him & all his Queeny mates in a Restaurant down Tottenham court road. We used to get free drinks from the local pub because the landlord fancied Mikey & untold Gayers piling in & hanging out for the day/evening. Then it would be on to a pub crawl round all the Gay bars & back to one of there flats to finish the night off.
I remember a group of Gayers I knew during this era that lived down Buckingham Road, Dalston. On the front door they had The Palace on a sign & were all Blatant Queens ;D Top bunch of Guys & a great bunch to hang with.
I've been to Heaven, The Elephant & Castle & even the Notorious Black room, Just about every Tranny show around London & just about every gay club an all.
What a lot of you youngsters don't realise is that when I was 18 the Best clubs were gay clubs & it was the gays that started the Rave scene :cool:
I was doing speckled Blues & raving all night in Gay clubs when most hadn't even heard of Raves.
For me Gayers are a Fun bunch of Guys who know how to party & I like to Party :cool:
My sister turning out to be a raving Lesbo & having a Gay marriage is thought of in the same way as if she was straight & marrying a Dude.
In all honesty I prefer her marrying her current partner as it means I won't have to beat the crap out of any men that Mess her about anymore. Men are ***** when it comes to them dating your little sister.
I won't comment on the Christian view as I just don't understand it. For me being a Christian is all about Forgiveness & acceptance. I would like to say though that your views are respected & very well recieved when given in such a Polite way :)
Von Smallhausen
21-07-2008, 19:23
Untold Gayer's ..... LOL.
Mr Diversity. :D
Living in Brighton changed my life, i made LOADS of good people from all kinds of background and into all kinds of things. I couldn't give a flying frack which side of the road they drive, i think it's cool that people do things that they love instead of conforming to society's old fashion views.
Just read the first post...
TTIUWP TBH
:D
Davey_Pitch
22-07-2008, 10:55
Just read the first post...
TTIUWP TBH
:D
Can't believe it took this long for someone to post that :D
Quite a mixed response I must say, its nice to know how you all feel about this :)
No that wasn't me coming out of the closet ;)
Doesn't bother me at all, but then again, with the amount of gay and bi friends I have that's not surprising really.
Gay people don't bother me at all :) I used to have a gay best friend but I had kids and he went to uni so we grew apart :(
Not bothered in the slightest. My friend at work is getting married to her long standing partner this summer. I say good luck to them as they are obviously showing their commitment to each other which is something I admire.
I sometimes wonder if the attitude of it not being natural etc is something to do with which generation you were born in. I know people like Sarah's(Wife) grandad would think it's un-natural given he is going on 70 now. Like sometimes he would refer to the news agent as the paki shop or the takeaway as the chinkies etc. Yet he doesn't have a problem with being gay, black, white, yellow etc. I guess its what was considered to be normal when he was growing up
I think we all have gay/lesbian friends here
I've just been thinking about the various people i'm friends with and came to the strange realisation that absolutely no one I can think of is gay, lesbian or even bi.
On a related note, I don't have a problem with it really, much the same as I never had a problem with guys buying me drinks last year.
Chuckles
22-07-2008, 12:51
You don't all have to post that you've got gay friends to prove you're not a homophobe by the way :D
Just read the first post...
TTIUWP TBH
:D
http://www.boat-drinks.co.uk/showthread.php?t=8606
Nothing NSFW though ;)
I don't have any gay friends....but one is quite camp....but he's not a poof as I've seen him kiss a girl.
As for me, don't really have a problem with it. If that's what people want to do then go for it.
Only thing I don't really like are the people that flaunt it. The whole point is that you want to be considered normal and to just blend in, yet take every opportunity to try and stand out. Confuses me.
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