DSLR or not - Page 2

Mark · 03-04-2007, 09:39

Agree with that too, nothing wrong with "old" as far as the camera itself goes, any camera is eventually going to be old.

For an experiment, I did some pricing up. Nikon D80 + grip + kit 18-135 + 70-300 VR = £1200. That gives me slightly more at both wide and telephoto than a typical bridge camera (27-450 vs 36-432), but I do understand both lenses are going to be compromises and not the best. As tempting as that is, I still suspect I'd be making a bad choice.

Dr. Z · 03-04-2007, 09:54

Yep.

Generally speaking, those 70-300 type lenses are cheap telephotos and although I believe the Nikon offering is slightly better than the Canon offering, its still not what you would want to be using at airshows tbh.

If you went DSLR, IMO you would want something like this (Canon though, thats what I know)

EOS30D, 18-55mm kit, battery grip, 100-400L and then if you wanted midrange it'd have to be a 70-200 F4/L. Really, for telephoto there is cack and then there is L glass (with a couple of exceptions).

Problem is that you are then looking at a cost in excess of £2000 all told. Yes its going to be better than a prosumer type camera by some quite considerable margin but factoring in the cost, not only in terms of money but in terms of portability and usability in everyday situations.

MB is a shining example of the latter - in the Pumphouse in Swansea he was there with his camera - it didnt attract any serious attention as a camera, he could just use it. I would imagine out and about its a similar story. You simply cannot get away with that kind of thing with a DSLR. Its immediately obvious you are there with a massive camera stood out like a sore thumb and out and about you just have to learn to deal with getting shouts of abuse from just about everyone under the age of 20 (and a good deal of those over 20!!).

Ultimately (as I am sure you know, but just for completeness here) its not a choice between image quality/zoom/features but a fundamental choice about how you want to progress with your photography as a personal development/lifestyle choice. Do you want it to be something you take along with you just in case or something you set out with to take some good pictures every time, regardless of how impractical that might be?

Mark · 03-04-2007, 10:25

Having held a D200 I can't help feeling you're totally correct. I needed this thread to properly figure out the pros and cons and it's achieved that. Many thanks for the replies.

The outcome? DSLR isn't for me. There, I do listen sometimes.

Now onto what Bridge camera to get. The Panasonic DMC-FZ8 is a 2007 generation camera that's already out and has reviews etc. My biggest concern with that camera is that the noise reduction tends to be hyperactive. I still like the Sony models despite them being 2006 and they score pretty well. Plus they'll hopefully drop some more in price, so maybe it is worth looking at those again (plus I have compatible batteries, filters, and memory cards already). I do know some camera retailers think of them as I do of the Panasonic though, so it does make me wonder.

List of candidates courtesy Steve's Digicams...

Canon Powershot S3 IS*
Panasonic DMC-FZ50*
Nikon Coolpix S10*
Sony Cybershot H5*
Kodak Easyshare Z612*
Panasonic DMC-FZ7/FZ8*
Fujifilm FinePix S6000fd
Sony Cybershot H2*
Olympus SP-510UZ
Kodak Easyshare P712*

* = has image stabilisation, which I think is a good idea.

Feek · 03-04-2007, 10:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRZ

and out and about you just have to learn to deal with getting shouts of abuse from just about everyone under the age of 20 (and a good deal of those over 20!!).

People will shout abuse at you just for having a camera?

Dr. Z · 03-04-2007, 13:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Feek

People will shout abuse at you just for having a camera?

Yep. Shouts of "paedo" and whatnot abound with disappointing regularity

Quote:

Originally Posted by kitten_caboodle

I think it's more a case of him being DRZ and having a camera.

But he wouldn't know that

I know more about being me than you think

Mark · 03-04-2007, 14:15

I'm going to go hold a D80 in my hands tomorrow. I'm still far more inclined to not get one, but I'd like to at least hold/play with one before turning it down. I've also been reading more reviews and getting more depressed by comments about noise even in low ISO (whether or not the outcome is a Highly Recommended) - silly me.

petemc · 03-04-2007, 15:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Feek

People will shout abuse at you just for having a camera?

I've had shouts of "Pedo!", beer thrown in my face, a salad from a car (?!?!), stones thrown at me, and one girl said I was stalking her. I haven't had anything major in a few months though, which is nice. Honestly, who throws a salad?

petemc · 03-04-2007, 15:39

Haha. That would be ok

Mark · 04-04-2007, 18:29

I behaved. Having held a D40, D80 and a 400D in my hands, I decided I should behave.

I now have beside me one Canon S3 IS.

petemc · 04-04-2007, 18:35

Congrats

If you need compact flash cards goto Play. San Disk cards are dirt cheap. Ultra 2 would be fine for the S3.

03-04-2007, 09:54	#12
Dr. Z I'm going for a scuttle... Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 2,021	Yep. Generally speaking, those 70-300 type lenses are cheap telephotos and although I believe the Nikon offering is slightly better than the Canon offering, its still not what you would want to be using at airshows tbh. If you went DSLR, IMO you would want something like this (Canon though, thats what I know) EOS30D, 18-55mm kit, battery grip, 100-400L and then if you wanted midrange it'd have to be a 70-200 F4/L. Really, for telephoto there is cack and then there is L glass (with a couple of exceptions). Problem is that you are then looking at a cost in excess of £2000 all told. Yes its going to be better than a prosumer type camera by some quite considerable margin but factoring in the cost, not only in terms of money but in terms of portability and usability in everyday situations. MB is a shining example of the latter - in the Pumphouse in Swansea he was there with his camera - it didnt attract any serious attention as a camera, he could just use it. I would imagine out and about its a similar story. You simply cannot get away with that kind of thing with a DSLR. Its immediately obvious you are there with a massive camera stood out like a sore thumb and out and about you just have to learn to deal with getting shouts of abuse from just about everyone under the age of 20 (and a good deal of those over 20!!). Ultimately (as I am sure you know, but just for completeness here) its not a choice between image quality/zoom/features but a fundamental choice about how you want to progress with your photography as a personal development/lifestyle choice. Do you want it to be something you take along with you just in case or something you set out with to take some good pictures every time, regardless of how impractical that might be? __________________

03-04-2007, 10:25	#13
Mark Screaming Orgasm Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Newbury Posts: 15,194	Having held a D200 I can't help feeling you're totally correct. I needed this thread to properly figure out the pros and cons and it's achieved that. Many thanks for the replies. The outcome? DSLR isn't for me. There, I do listen sometimes. Now onto what Bridge camera to get. The Panasonic DMC-FZ8 is a 2007 generation camera that's already out and has reviews etc. My biggest concern with that camera is that the noise reduction tends to be hyperactive. I still like the Sony models despite them being 2006 and they score pretty well. Plus they'll hopefully drop some more in price, so maybe it is worth looking at those again (plus I have compatible batteries, filters, and memory cards already). I do know some camera retailers think of them as I do of the Panasonic though, so it does make me wonder. List of candidates courtesy Steve's Digicams... Canon Powershot S3 IS* Panasonic DMC-FZ50* Nikon Coolpix S10* Sony Cybershot H5* Kodak Easyshare Z612* Panasonic DMC-FZ7/FZ8* Fujifilm FinePix S6000fd Sony Cybershot H2* Olympus SP-510UZ Kodak Easyshare P712* * = has image stabilisation, which I think is a good idea. Last edited by Mark; 03-04-2007 at 10:32.

03-04-2007, 15:39	#18
petemc Moonshine Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Nr Liverpewl Posts: 4,371	Haha. That would be ok __________________ Thats no hamster, its a space station!

04-04-2007, 18:35	#20
petemc Moonshine Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Nr Liverpewl Posts: 4,371	Congrats If you need compact flash cards goto Play. San Disk cards are dirt cheap. Ultra 2 would be fine for the S3. __________________ Thats no hamster, its a space station!

03-04-2007, 09:39	#11
Mark Screaming Orgasm Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Newbury Posts: 15,194	Agree with that too, nothing wrong with "old" as far as the camera itself goes, any camera is eventually going to be old. For an experiment, I did some pricing up. Nikon D80 + grip + kit 18-135 + 70-300 VR = £1200. That gives me slightly more at both wide and telephoto than a typical bridge camera (27-450 vs 36-432), but I do understand both lenses are going to be compromises and not the best. As tempting as that is, I still suspect I'd be making a bad choice.

03-04-2007, 14:15	#16
Mark Screaming Orgasm Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Newbury Posts: 15,194	I'm going to go hold a D80 in my hands tomorrow. I'm still far more inclined to not get one, but I'd like to at least hold/play with one before turning it down. I've also been reading more reviews and getting more depressed by comments about noise even in low ISO (whether or not the outcome is a Highly Recommended) - silly me.

04-04-2007, 18:29	#19
Mark Screaming Orgasm Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Newbury Posts: 15,194	I behaved. Having held a D40, D80 and a 400D in my hands, I decided I should behave. I now have beside me one Canon S3 IS.