Getting further into Web Design

HollyThirtyFive · 26-03-2008, 14:13

After doing my beginner Open Uni web design course I've decided when I get back from travelling to work really hard on the higher Web Design courses untill I'm confident enough to become independent/gain employment with my skills.

Also my boyfriend wants to learn some too and we have an idea to eventually run a business from it (this is of course un predictable but something we would both like to work on)

I was wondering if anyone here is a web designer/developer by profession, how they started, learnt, how long it took etc just to gain advice on what direction I should head in :-)

I've begun to teach myself Flash Pro as I know it will be a big help (but a while before I become good at it lol)

x

Mark · 26-03-2008, 15:04

From what I've heard web design is a bit of a difficult 'nut' to crack, as it seems every man and their dog *think* they can do it (and then usually make a complete hash of it).

The net result is that as a new entrant it can be difficult to get yourself noticed above the noise, and even harder to get repeat business and/or referals, which are what you need to maintain a healthy cashflow.

Not wanting to put you off but you probably need to at least be thinking about a business plan before getting too far down that road.

iCraig · 26-03-2008, 15:06

I stumbled into the job by fortune more than actively searching for it. I was messing about with websites for a year or so and was loving it. I learnt the basics of photoshop myself and advanced with the help of tutorials and simply playing about with the tools in there. HTML I learnt by simply using it, as with any language I guess. CSS was the same.

Anyway, I was plodding along doing my own website, constantly redesigning it, when the time came for a new PC. My neighbour recommended we went with his mate from work who did PCs etc, and after a very competitive quote we had a new one off him. When he came over to set it up we got chatting and he told me the other side of his business was websites and online stuff. I showed him my own website and its various designs and he was impressed. He went on his way and I heard nothing more for a few months until they added me on MSN and asked if I was interested in doing some freelance work for them. It was only simple stuff, design a site for a customer and ship the PSD over to the developer to slice it up and make a site out of it. I went through a few and even though it was only a small amount each time, I really enjoyed it being still at sixth form the money was a nice bonus anyway. When I left sixth form they approached me again and offered me an apprenticeship, bringing me into the company full time. I loved every second of it, and still do. I design the websites and also develop them too. My boss is a software programmer and deals with all the SQL and Perl stuff. I'm now in the final year of my apprenticeship and actually finish in July. I know I have a full time job with an official position ready for me, so the future is bright and I really love my job.

Advice wise, it all depends on what element of website design you want to get into. I'm the creative sort, so I lean towards the form side of things rather than function, however I do the basic development. There's the programming side of things too, writing website software such as content management packages, e-commerce etc and then there's all the different niches that you can specialise in as well, such as SEO, flash etc. In my experience, running a business on website design can be sketchy. Our company stays afloat because we're double sided, and the frequency of money coming in is pretty stable, but if it was just website work, I think we'd struggle. We have some months where we don't invoice out.

HollyThirtyFive · 26-03-2008, 18:15

Well I do have a "plan" obviously not a business plan to start my own right now because I want to study and become confident before I think of that.

I cant do anything properly untill I get back, but throughout open uni you can gain a Web Applications certificate, it means 6 quite full courses for 3 months each and they cover most areas of design/developing/servers etc it does cost money ofcourse but I'm going to use some savings money put aside. I want to work part time whilst studying too but that wont be too much of a problem.

I would say I am mainly interested in the creative side, Im already quite fluent in Photoshop so thats a bonus. But I want to work as hard as I can to also learn the Web developing side to.

I've been looking at current job vacancies for web designers to give myself an idea of what qualifications I need to get. Another idea is to put an advert in the local paper when I feel confident enough to create my own website single handedly asking if any businesses/charities would like a web site built to make a portfolio.

It might take a few years to get somewhere but I'm willing to work for it :-)

petemc · 26-03-2008, 19:09

I used to be a web designer / developer. Off the top of my head I don't think there are any qualifications you need, per say. You really need a good portfolio. Employers will list a set of tools that they expect you to know and you turn up showing them that you can use it. Then they sit around drinking coffee while randomly deciding who gets the job.

Design, technically speaking, isn't something you learn. You've either got an eye for it or not and if you have you develop that eye. I think I've always had an eye for design but it wasn't until I found photography that I was really able to develop that eye. Even though I had spent 5 years doing web design I just wasn't able to make the leap from average joe designer to industry name. I wasn't really anything special. So if you've got it, you've got it and you just need that one job to bring it out. Developing is easier because all you have to do is learn code. PHP, ASP, Ruby, SQL, ETC. The glitch with web developing though is that you still need a nice front end. Then there's Flash. Again, you need design skills to do one side of it and coding skills to do the other. You can make a career just from Flash. Personally I'd say look at HTML4, watch whats going on with HTML5 too. Learn XHTML, CSS, typography, how to use white space and such. Lastly there's all the fun of accessability. One of the reasons why I left web design was due to all the hoops you have to jump through. I loved being creative but then you have to take the PSD and distort it so it works in all the browsers in the world ever while making it perfectly accessible too. I just want to create!! Good luck

Mark · 26-03-2008, 19:28

Pete's spot on.

I can code all day every day, but ask me to get artistic and I'll tell you to go away. I can tell you what I think works and what doesn't. I can even do basic text layouts that work fairly well, but ask me for a PSD, or a GIF (PNG for the purists), or even a Flash animation, and I'd rapidly disappear in a puff of artistry.

HollyThirtyFive · 26-03-2008, 21:45

Thanks for all the advice :-) I think I feel kind of the same way because the thought of learning the code isn't as appealing but at the same time I really like teaching myself html so Im really looking forward to cracking onto that. Thats why I really cant wait to get learning!

The open uni courses are:
Web basics: design, development and management (i look forward to doing this one)
The client-side of application development
The server-side of application development
Databases within website design
Open source development tools
Web server management, performance and tuning

That is a lot of work, and I know getting a portfolio together is the most important thing so I may not get through all of them but it will teach me the non-design side to web development.

Becoming good in flash would be amazing!! But it's a very long way away for now, after my first lesson I could make a banner fade in and out so i'd give it a couple of years lol nothings impossible if I stick my head down though

26-03-2008, 14:13	#1
HollyThirtyFive Tinkerbell Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Burgess Hill, West Sussex Posts: 743	Getting further into Web Design After doing my beginner Open Uni web design course I've decided when I get back from travelling to work really hard on the higher Web Design courses untill I'm confident enough to become independent/gain employment with my skills. Also my boyfriend wants to learn some too and we have an idea to eventually run a business from it (this is of course un predictable but something we would both like to work on) I was wondering if anyone here is a web designer/developer by profession, how they started, learnt, how long it took etc just to gain advice on what direction I should head in :-) I've begun to teach myself Flash Pro as I know it will be a big help (but a while before I become good at it lol) x __________________ Debut album "Waking Up" Avaliable on all iTunes stores, Amazon Mp3 Special Hand Made Ltd Edition: £10 via Paypal

26-03-2008, 15:06	#3
iCraig iCustom User Title Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 2,250	I stumbled into the job by fortune more than actively searching for it. I was messing about with websites for a year or so and was loving it. I learnt the basics of photoshop myself and advanced with the help of tutorials and simply playing about with the tools in there. HTML I learnt by simply using it, as with any language I guess. CSS was the same. Anyway, I was plodding along doing my own website, constantly redesigning it, when the time came for a new PC. My neighbour recommended we went with his mate from work who did PCs etc, and after a very competitive quote we had a new one off him. When he came over to set it up we got chatting and he told me the other side of his business was websites and online stuff. I showed him my own website and its various designs and he was impressed. He went on his way and I heard nothing more for a few months until they added me on MSN and asked if I was interested in doing some freelance work for them. It was only simple stuff, design a site for a customer and ship the PSD over to the developer to slice it up and make a site out of it. I went through a few and even though it was only a small amount each time, I really enjoyed it being still at sixth form the money was a nice bonus anyway. When I left sixth form they approached me again and offered me an apprenticeship, bringing me into the company full time. I loved every second of it, and still do. I design the websites and also develop them too. My boss is a software programmer and deals with all the SQL and Perl stuff. I'm now in the final year of my apprenticeship and actually finish in July. I know I have a full time job with an official position ready for me, so the future is bright and I really love my job. Advice wise, it all depends on what element of website design you want to get into. I'm the creative sort, so I lean towards the form side of things rather than function, however I do the basic development. There's the programming side of things too, writing website software such as content management packages, e-commerce etc and then there's all the different niches that you can specialise in as well, such as SEO, flash etc. In my experience, running a business on website design can be sketchy. Our company stays afloat because we're double sided, and the frequency of money coming in is pretty stable, but if it was just website work, I think we'd struggle. We have some months where we don't invoice out. __________________

26-03-2008, 18:15	#4
HollyThirtyFive Tinkerbell Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Burgess Hill, West Sussex Posts: 743	Well I do have a "plan" obviously not a business plan to start my own right now because I want to study and become confident before I think of that. I cant do anything properly untill I get back, but throughout open uni you can gain a Web Applications certificate, it means 6 quite full courses for 3 months each and they cover most areas of design/developing/servers etc it does cost money ofcourse but I'm going to use some savings money put aside. I want to work part time whilst studying too but that wont be too much of a problem. I would say I am mainly interested in the creative side, Im already quite fluent in Photoshop so thats a bonus. But I want to work as hard as I can to also learn the Web developing side to. I've been looking at current job vacancies for web designers to give myself an idea of what qualifications I need to get. Another idea is to put an advert in the local paper when I feel confident enough to create my own website single handedly asking if any businesses/charities would like a web site built to make a portfolio. It might take a few years to get somewhere but I'm willing to work for it :-) __________________ Debut album "Waking Up" Avaliable on all iTunes stores, Amazon Mp3 Special Hand Made Ltd Edition: £10 via Paypal

26-03-2008, 19:09	#5
petemc Moonshine Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Nr Liverpewl Posts: 4,371	I used to be a web designer / developer. Off the top of my head I don't think there are any qualifications you need, per say. You really need a good portfolio. Employers will list a set of tools that they expect you to know and you turn up showing them that you can use it. Then they sit around drinking coffee while randomly deciding who gets the job. Design, technically speaking, isn't something you learn. You've either got an eye for it or not and if you have you develop that eye. I think I've always had an eye for design but it wasn't until I found photography that I was really able to develop that eye. Even though I had spent 5 years doing web design I just wasn't able to make the leap from average joe designer to industry name. I wasn't really anything special. So if you've got it, you've got it and you just need that one job to bring it out. Developing is easier because all you have to do is learn code. PHP, ASP, Ruby, SQL, ETC. The glitch with web developing though is that you still need a nice front end. Then there's Flash. Again, you need design skills to do one side of it and coding skills to do the other. You can make a career just from Flash. Personally I'd say look at HTML4, watch whats going on with HTML5 too. Learn XHTML, CSS, typography, how to use white space and such. Lastly there's all the fun of accessability. One of the reasons why I left web design was due to all the hoops you have to jump through. I loved being creative but then you have to take the PSD and distort it so it works in all the browsers in the world ever while making it perfectly accessible too. I just want to create!! Good luck __________________ Thats no hamster, its a space station!

26-03-2008, 21:45	#7
HollyThirtyFive Tinkerbell Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Burgess Hill, West Sussex Posts: 743	Thanks for all the advice :-) I think I feel kind of the same way because the thought of learning the code isn't as appealing but at the same time I really like teaching myself html so Im really looking forward to cracking onto that. Thats why I really cant wait to get learning! The open uni courses are: Web basics: design, development and management (i look forward to doing this one) The client-side of application development The server-side of application development Databases within website design Open source development tools Web server management, performance and tuning That is a lot of work, and I know getting a portfolio together is the most important thing so I may not get through all of them but it will teach me the non-design side to web development. Becoming good in flash would be amazing!! But it's a very long way away for now, after my first lesson I could make a banner fade in and out so i'd give it a couple of years lol nothings impossible if I stick my head down though __________________ Debut album "Waking Up" Avaliable on all iTunes stores, Amazon Mp3 Special Hand Made Ltd Edition: £10 via Paypal

26-03-2008, 15:04	#2
Mark Screaming Orgasm Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Newbury Posts: 15,194	From what I've heard web design is a bit of a difficult 'nut' to crack, as it seems every man and their dog think they can do it (and then usually make a complete hash of it). The net result is that as a new entrant it can be difficult to get yourself noticed above the noise, and even harder to get repeat business and/or referals, which are what you need to maintain a healthy cashflow. Not wanting to put you off but you probably need to at least be thinking about a business plan before getting too far down that road.

26-03-2008, 19:28	#6
Mark Screaming Orgasm Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Newbury Posts: 15,194	Pete's spot on. I can code all day every day, but ask me to get artistic and I'll tell you to go away. I can tell you what I think works and what doesn't. I can even do basic text layouts that work fairly well, but ask me for a PSD, or a GIF (PNG for the purists), or even a Flash animation, and I'd rapidly disappear in a puff of artistry.