Virtualization home server questions...

LeperousDust · 05-03-2008, 18:31

Right it struck me the other day (reading daveys thread) rather than fooling around with one ubuntu install, and trying to get a printer to play nice with the other windows installations, couldn't i install for instance VMWare on a platform of my choice (probably server 2003 /XP Pro), then set up some virtual machines, one for just printer sharing (in a windows environment), an ubuntu one for file sharing etc...? This is a sound reason for virtualization yuh-huh? Plus it means i can test it out of other PC's and then literally just move them above and/or backup where needed?

Mark · 05-03-2008, 18:51

Of course you can.

Wasn't the whole Ubuntu thing to do RAID though? I wouldn't run that in a VM, personally, but everything else should be fine.

LeperousDust · 05-03-2008, 23:11

Yeah, well i'd run the VM on one hard drive, couldn't they have access to the other four there for raiding? Or is that asking for trouble/more hassle?

Daz · 06-03-2008, 12:22

While you can do it, unless you have a real reason to you dont give VMs access to the raw disks - you give them virtual disks, ie, files on your current file system. You could give it 3 or 4 virtual disks and raid them, but there's no point really, as they'll probably be on the same underlying file system

LeperousDust · 06-03-2008, 13:33

Could i give it 4 virtual disks that live seperately on each physical disk? My setup is:
2 * 40Gb (maybe mirror them, probably just use one to back the other up)
4 * 400Gb these are empty and want to be utilised. What kind of performance/penalty would get in terms of virtualisation with Ubuntu and VMware using virtual disks (or not?). I only ask because i'd love to use Ubuntu as my main OS on there, but the whole printer setup is crap. It does the job just about, but its severely slow and gets confused easily because the computers don't "talk" to each other. If my mate forgets to turn the printer on and tries to print (which you wouldn't believe how often happens) its a nightmare to get working (without resetting his PC) again, whereas within two windows environment apart from more access to the driver options its just quicker and easier, annoying but true.... Or could i run a VM inside my Ubuntu install? That sounds good, but like its going to be "fun"

LeperousDust · 06-03-2008, 22:30

Yay/Nay on the virtual server on ubuntu idea? I need a little rassurance because i need to pull the server down and move it so i can get to work on it, where it is isn't very me friends plus the monitor it had plugged in has broken now

Mark · 06-03-2008, 23:19

I've run Ubuntu as a VM, and run VMWare on Linux. Indeed I've run Gentoo -> VMWare -> Ubuntu (and still do).

However, Daz is right. You shouldn't give a VM direct disk access, and I don't see the benefit of filling physical disks with virtual disks. Virtual disks are (comparitively) slow, and can crash just as well as physical disks - I've had it happen (the physical disk was fine but the virtual disk fried itself). What you're proposing here sounds like a solution to a problem that doesn't exist.

My recommendation - run Ubuntu natively for the RAID as you do now. Run VMWare on top of that and a virtual Windows installation to do anything Windows-ish (like the printer sharing).

LeperousDust · 07-03-2008, 00:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark

My recommendation - run Ubuntu natively for the RAID as you do now. Run VMWare on top of that and a virtual Windows installation to do anything Windows-ish (like the printer sharing).

Cool that was my second plan, wish i'd done this ages ago! What should i be looking at software wise within Ubuntu though? Anything special out there?

Mark · 07-03-2008, 01:24

VMWare Server. Not sure it's in the repositories but it's an easy-ish install if not.

Daz · 07-03-2008, 22:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark

VMWare Server. Not sure it's in the repositories but it's an easy-ish install if not.

It's in the repo's, enable partner, then install from synaptic or apt-get install vmware-server, done፡)

05-03-2008, 18:31	#1
LeperousDust Bananaman Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Liverpool/Edinburgh Posts: 4,817	Virtualization home server questions... Right it struck me the other day (reading daveys thread) rather than fooling around with one ubuntu install, and trying to get a printer to play nice with the other windows installations, couldn't i install for instance VMWare on a platform of my choice (probably server 2003 /XP Pro), then set up some virtual machines, one for just printer sharing (in a windows environment), an ubuntu one for file sharing etc...? This is a sound reason for virtualization yuh-huh? Plus it means i can test it out of other PC's and then literally just move them above and/or backup where needed? __________________

05-03-2008, 23:11	#3
LeperousDust Bananaman Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Liverpool/Edinburgh Posts: 4,817	Yeah, well i'd run the VM on one hard drive, couldn't they have access to the other four there for raiding? Or is that asking for trouble/more hassle? __________________

06-03-2008, 12:22	#4
Daz The Stig Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Swad! Posts: 10,713	While you can do it, unless you have a real reason to you dont give VMs access to the raw disks - you give them virtual disks, ie, files on your current file system. You could give it 3 or 4 virtual disks and raid them, but there's no point really, as they'll probably be on the same underlying file system __________________ apt-get moo

06-03-2008, 13:33	#5
LeperousDust Bananaman Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Liverpool/Edinburgh Posts: 4,817	Could i give it 4 virtual disks that live seperately on each physical disk? My setup is: 2 * 40Gb (maybe mirror them, probably just use one to back the other up) 4 * 400Gb these are empty and want to be utilised. What kind of performance/penalty would get in terms of virtualisation with Ubuntu and VMware using virtual disks (or not?). I only ask because i'd love to use Ubuntu as my main OS on there, but the whole printer setup is crap. It does the job just about, but its severely slow and gets confused easily because the computers don't "talk" to each other. If my mate forgets to turn the printer on and tries to print (which you wouldn't believe how often happens) its a nightmare to get working (without resetting his PC) again, whereas within two windows environment apart from more access to the driver options its just quicker and easier, annoying but true.... Or could i run a VM inside my Ubuntu install? That sounds good, but like its going to be "fun" __________________

06-03-2008, 22:30	#6
LeperousDust Bananaman Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Liverpool/Edinburgh Posts: 4,817	Yay/Nay on the virtual server on ubuntu idea? I need a little rassurance because i need to pull the server down and move it so i can get to work on it, where it is isn't very me friends plus the monitor it had plugged in has broken now __________________

05-03-2008, 18:51	#2
Mark Screaming Orgasm Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Newbury Posts: 15,194	Of course you can. Wasn't the whole Ubuntu thing to do RAID though? I wouldn't run that in a VM, personally, but everything else should be fine.

06-03-2008, 23:19	#7
Mark Screaming Orgasm Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Newbury Posts: 15,194	I've run Ubuntu as a VM, and run VMWare on Linux. Indeed I've run Gentoo -> VMWare -> Ubuntu (and still do). However, Daz is right. You shouldn't give a VM direct disk access, and I don't see the benefit of filling physical disks with virtual disks. Virtual disks are (comparitively) slow, and can crash just as well as physical disks - I've had it happen (the physical disk was fine but the virtual disk fried itself). What you're proposing here sounds like a solution to a problem that doesn't exist. My recommendation - run Ubuntu natively for the RAID as you do now. Run VMWare on top of that and a virtual Windows installation to do anything Windows-ish (like the printer sharing).

07-03-2008, 01:24	#9
Mark Screaming Orgasm Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Newbury Posts: 15,194	VMWare Server. Not sure it's in the repositories but it's an easy-ish install if not.