Welfare mothers to be forced to work

[vix]

It's not like - 'Whoops I've had a baby' is it? Phil and I nearly had to make that decision a few years ago and it was like 'Well we can't really afford it at the mo can we?'

[Del Lardo]

Originally Posted by mejinks

Sometimes it not just that easy, it just happens. Don't get me wrong, I think that people who are capable of working should. Its just we shouldn't be victimising single mothers who are in their situation by choice or not.

How many more bad ideas is this government going to come up with before they force people into open revolt?

More likely to be civil war than open revolt. There's a hell of a lot or harding working middle class people out there like myself who are utterly fed up with paying for people to sit on their arses because they believe the state owes them a living.

Single mothers aren't the only ones to be effected as these are sweeping reforms but they have been highlighted in the article as currently they do not have to look for work until their youngest child is 14 years old. Now taking some of the single mothers living just down the road from me as examples they have kids ranging from new born to ~12 years old meaning that if they had their first kid at 16 under current legislation they wouldn't have to work until they were 42.

I could give numerous examples of single mothers who have wanted to work to support their family rather than claiming benefits and have made it work because they have the right mindset. Unfortionately in the modern day X-Factor Britain a lot of people believe the state owes them a living and they can get rich not by hard work but by becoming the next Jordan.

I'm not trying to say that there aren't people out there who don't genuinely need help or people that want to work who can't get work but in number terms there are probably hundreds of thousands of people who see living off the state as a long term 'career' and something has to be done about these people otherwise the welfare system will simply collapse.

[mejinks]

Originally Posted by vix

It's not like - 'Whoops I've had a baby' is it? Phil and I nearly had to make that decision a few years ago and it was like 'Well we can't really afford it at the mo can we?'

Yes, but you can get pregnant accidentally. Thats the point I was trying to make.

[vix]

And then you can assess the situation and deal with it accordingly. that's the point I was trying to make.

[Pheebs]

Reference the single Mums, I have known a number of single Mums in my life time and all of them have managed to work to support their children. Yes, they have had some extra support income wise which I think is fair enough considering they're trying their best.

How is it then that these people I have known (civvy police officers, nurses, accountants etc) have managed to juggle jobs and a child and others can't?

In fact, one of them was superb. She left her child with child care three days a week and then two days a week with her family. She did part time work with the police which worked around child care and school and any overtime she could manage she did. Not long after meeting her, the council found her a home and she moved in there. She was so over the moon. After doing some research she found out she could earn more if she wasn't working - after the child care was paid for etc she was left with not a lot to spare.

However.

She didn't quit her job - she just worked harder. Why? Because she wanted to one day own a house of her own and show the kids that she was doing something to provide for them. Plus it gave her independence to an extent and meant she had a social life and so on.


In my opinion, the government should do more to support these type of people than to those without work.

Another case I would mention too - when I was working at a school I was dealing with kids with Behavioural issues. When I was speaking with one of them about what she was going to do after her GCSEs her words to me was:

"I wanna have a baby"

When I asked why she said:

"cos they're cute ain't they. I love 'em."

When I asked how they would support them:

"I'd just do nuffink like my Mum. She gets paid and everything. Ha!"


This was the view of a number of girls at the school. Two of them have since been knocked up. :/

So, being a single Mum and living at home and doing nothing.... in my opinion *can* give off the completely wrong impression to kids.

On the contrary, another kid I know in a single Mum home loved his Mother so so SO much. She was struggling like crazy to get a job/hold one down (she had anger management issues) but she tried and tried so so hard and her son saw that and thought it was amazing. He actually spent his own money on her from his Father to buy her shoes for an interview. His words to me: "I don't want to end up jobless like my Mum. She gets really sad. I want to get a job and help her as much as I can. I could get her a suit for work and everything."

Such a sweet heart

[TinkerBell]

I have to agree with the majority, that you shouldn't have children until you are able to look after them yourself, to feed them with your own hard earned cash, but I do see that there are times when this is not possible. I for one would find it mightly difficult to have an abortion, which I can see would be the same for alot of woman, but I do not think that this means that they shouldn't get a job or try and earn some money.

I can kind of see mejinks point, but at the end of the day why should some single mother's be able to stay home and spend that special time with the kids while other single mother's have to go to work? I know what it was like for my mother being a single parent, and she found it hard, but she never gave up trying to keep a job, there were times when money were tight. I remember being very young and my mom cleaning houses and she took me with her because there was no one else to look after me, and another time when I was older, we used to have to get up really early on a weekend and set up a market stall to earn some more money.

I think that everyone should at least attempt to make money, and if they have children and they are tight with money, then that is what family and friends are for, ask them to look after the kids while you do some part time work, especially when they are in school. What is stopping mother's from getting a part time job while the kid is at school? Nothing, just pure lazyness.

If there are literally no options to get around it, then they should at least do something to help the community. After all the people in the community pay for their food, community service should be a must to be quite honest.

[AboveTheSalt]

Originally Posted by Pheebs

...

Another case I would mention too - when I was working at a school I was dealing with kids with Behavioural issues. When I was speaking with one of them about what she was going to do after her GCSEs her words to me was:

"I wanna have a baby"

When I asked why she said:

"cos they're cute ain't they. I love 'em."

When I asked how they would support them:

"I'd just do nuffink like my Mum. She gets paid and everything. Ha!"


This was the view of a number of girls at the school. Two of them have since been knocked up. :/

...

Not all that unusual. I think that most people agree that this behaviour is wrong. However, I have yet to hear a practical solution. What I would really like to know is how you plan to stop this happening:

• compulsory sterilisation
• compulsory abortion
• allow the mother to have the child and take it into care
• allow the mother to have the child and then let them both starve

I am aware of a local "educationally challenged" woman who has had ten children, with more than one man. All have been taken into care, shortly after birth. It seems likely that some of them at least are also "educationally challenged" and will probably end up following their mother's path. What do you do?

[Pheebs]

Originally Posted by AboveTheSalt

Not all that unusual. I think that most people agree that this behaviour is wrong. However, I have yet to hear a practical solution. What I would really like to know is how you plan to stop this happening:

• compulsory sterilisation
• compulsory abortion
• allow the mother to have the child and take it into care
• allow the mother to have the child and then let them both starve

I am aware of a local "educationally challenged" woman who has had ten children, with more than one man. All have been taken into care, shortly after birth. It seems likely that some of them at least are also "educationally challenged" and will probably end up following their mother's path. What do you do?

What do you do or what would you do?! If it's what do I do, I'm a designer

See now you say educationally challenged but these girls weren't. When I worked with them and spent a year getting to know them their grades rapidly came up and they were on the road to some good GCSEs. Not brilliant, but good enough to get into college. One girl admitted to me that she didn't think she was any good at anything because that's all she heard from everyone else. It was a kind of stigma, which was really sad as she would have made an *excellent* hair dresser... but she decided to jack it in because "why bother" getting up in the mornings when she can get paid for lying in and doing nothing. :/

Wish I had been in that school a year or two prior as she just needed a bit more time to work with and she would have been able to do it.

Personally I think a lot of these "educationally challenged" people are using this as an excuse - you don't need a degree or GCSEs to be a cleaner or do sales or be a hairdresser. It's a load of codswollop. You just need the drive and determination.

Solutions wise, I can't really offer much. I've always said that the government should provide benefits for the first two children that are had - the rest is up to them to sort... but then you're basically punishing the 3rd or 4th child that comes along.

Boo

[Desmo]

The solution for me is to replace most of the money handed out with vouchers. Vouchers can be accepted anywhere, in any shop, but only on certain items. Now you can reduce the benefits being handed out and make sure it's only spent on necessary items and not beer, fags, sky and consoles.

I understand that people don't always choose to be in the position they're in, but that also doesn't mean that some can sit there and, in my opinion, take the piss out of the rest of working society.

I know I've over simplified the whole process somewhat, but I do think that vouchers, and not cash, are the way forward.

[Burble]

I like your thinking Desmo.