Vegetarianism - The Debate - Page 2

Belmit · 23-02-2008, 11:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kitten

This is a very subjective and personal subject. Individuals will have very strong opinions and will feel that their way is the right one - otherwise they wouldn't follow it.

This is why I choose not to debate things like this. Sort of ironic that as a meat-eater my view is to live and let live. If I believe something is wrong then I might debate it in order to change someone's mind, but when it comes to simple lifestyle choices I can't see the point in debating it. It's like trying to change someone's idea of what their favourite colour should be.

In other words, I've entered this debate to affirm that I won't be debating about it. I suck at the internet!

Jasper · 23-02-2008, 11:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kitten

as I said Jasper it's subjective. Maybe you see it because you know she didn't mean it like that, or because you feel the same way about it already.

I'm trying to explain why people feel like it's 'guilt-tripping' for want of a better word, or 'patronising', I personally assume it's not meant in a patronising way but I'm pointing out how it's likely to be taken. It's bound to be emotive if Goldi feels so strongly about it and generally that's where the problems start (remember the roses??

)

yeah, you just said that you'd taken it as patronising and that she had no right to tell you that you needed to be educated - I was merely pointing out in her absence that that's not how it was meant at all

FakeSnake · 23-02-2008, 11:33

If your (GL & Jasp) choice of food lifestyle is because of the ethics of how animals are brought up, what do you feel about proper farm reared meat?

While we do buy and eat some 'mass produced' meat from the supermarkets, a lot of our meat comes from a farm about 4 miles from my house, directly from the farm shop.
I know how his animals are reared, I can see them in the fields!

if you have chosen your food lifestyle because you dont agree with killing for food, thats quite a different argument.

Tak · 23-02-2008, 11:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Belmit

In other words, I've entered this debate to affirm that I won't be debating about it. I suck at the internet!

Justsomebloke · 23-02-2008, 11:36

Meat substitute

I thought She meant a Dildo

Poor attempt to lighten the mood.

My favourite X girlf was a Full on vegan way back & she introduced me to veggie burgers & the like. Lots of her friends were veggies as well so i have been around the whole Meat is Murder thing. I always thought it was quite admirable that she would eat crap & change her lifestyle to avoid causing pain/suffering to animals but then she was a Lovely person

There were days when i didn't eat meat for a couple of days but i Always had to eat meat on the 3rd day, She Never once lectured me on what to eat & i Never commented negatively on her lifestyle choice. Her passion for things was what made her Special, In the world, in her group & with me

Muban · 23-02-2008, 11:36

I'm not really sure what there is to 'get'? People have different levels of what they will or choose to eat, right from people who will eat anything (literally) to people who are vegetarian or vegan. I eat quite a range of food, including most meats and though I understand the (many differing) reasons for why people choose not to eat meat or animal products I don't think that is a choice I will ever make.

It is something I have thought about as I do have consideration for what I put into my body. For example I wouldnt ever have Foie Gras, for me personally it crosses a line but if anyone else wants to eat it I am ok with it. I have many vegan and vegetarian products in my kitchen, of course I get them as they taste nice, provide variety to my diet or in some cases provide an alternative to things I choose not to eat. In fact if someone made an 'alternative' Fois Gras I woudl try it as I have heard it tastes amazing.

I'm quite happy to make vegetarian or vegan meals for freinds (in fact quite often I make them for myself without realising

). Well made food with quality ingredients tastes good no matter what in my opinion. I occasionally use 'alternative' products, why not is just a different flavour?

Hmmm I feel I have rambled on a bit there

I can understand why this thread could offend though, I know if someone referred to what I ate as crap and that I should be a real omnivore it would **** me off.

Will · 23-02-2008, 11:39

I think we should bring back hinting for food. I reckon a lot of people would become vegetarian then

I agree that some foods are prepared in disgraceful ways, such as foie gras - however, I will still eat it because I do very much like it. I have no justification other than it's really really nice and I enjoy it. For that I do put my hand up it is cruel and I have no defence for myself. It won't stop me though I'm afraid - I've seen them force feed geese and whilst it's a bit horrid, I can't stop thinking about the end result.

I've been up to my elbows in entrails when I did some work at a butchers/slaughter houses. It didn't phase me because to me it came across as totally natural - I even found it mildly poetic and beautiful that such an animal can provide so much nutrition for so many people. In a way it would be great if meat could be spared for the people who know about food and appreciate food - but that brings in horrible elitism which our society has enough of now. I wish meats went to butchers and not to supermarkets and weren't mass produced I really really do believe this. However in this country and the western modern world it just won't happen.

I'd love to boycott every mass produced item, but I'm afraid in this world it's just not possible, certainly not when I very much need meat as part of my diet.

Justsomebloke · 23-02-2008, 11:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muban

Hmmm I feel I have rambled on a bit there

I can understand why this thread could offend though, I know if someone referred to what I ate as crap and that I should be a real omnivore it would **** me off.

Just realised i did that in my own post

My crap is not meant to mean all veggy food is crap it was just crap as in crap, my food is crap

Aaaaaaarrrggghhhhh I was trying to be all Mellow there an all.
Apologys to the Veggys

Jasper · 23-02-2008, 11:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by FakeSnake

If your (GL & Jasp) choice of food lifestyle is because of the ethics of how animals are brought up, what do you feel about proper farm reared meat?

While we do buy and eat some 'mass produced' meat from the supermarkets, a lot of our meat comes from a farm about 4 miles from my house, directly from the farm shop.
I know how his animals are reared, I can see them in the fields!

if you have chosen your food lifestyle because you dont agree with killing for food, thats quite a different argument.

see my giant post at the start

In short - I love animals and I don't like the thought of them being killed to be eaten (this is an important bit to me: ) whilst I can survive on a substitute

goldilocks · 23-02-2008, 11:46

oooh too many people to reply to!

in response to the comments I made about Jonnys idea for a veggie thread - i thought he meant a vegetarian recipe thread - not a debating thread.
my point was that although i can't 'learn' anything from a '10 things to do with your steak' thread - everyone can benefit from a ' how to make vegetables interesting' discussion

there are plenty of tasty ways for meat eaters to incorporate vege alternatives into their diets - but it doesn't really work the other way around!

as for the issue about guilt tripping - emotive language is only used because it is how i feel about the issue, if you started a thread on Catholicism (?!omg) i'd probably be as vocal. :/

i wouldn't eat animals, even if we reared them ourselves, because for me - bringing up a 'family' couldn't end with me eating them

as Jasper has said, eating meat is not a necessity - no mater how well reared and cared for the animals were - i don't think i could bring myself to eat them. like it's been mentioned - the fact that we are so taken away from the process of animal rearing / slaughter is one of the reasons so many people haven't gone veggie - i'm sure if we had to ring our own chickens neck - it might but a few more souls off!

i was not brought up vegetarian - i ate meat until i was about 10. my parents, grandma and brother all eat meat, Jasper ate meat when we started dating - and continued to do so for about a year after we met (i didn't coerce him into stopping - it was his decision, honest!) i can't ever imagine going back to eating meat, not even after a reasoned and considered debate!

23-02-2008, 11:36	#15
Justsomebloke The Night Worker Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 5,228	Meat substitute I thought She meant a Dildo Poor attempt to lighten the mood. My favourite X girlf was a Full on vegan way back & she introduced me to veggie burgers & the like. Lots of her friends were veggies as well so i have been around the whole Meat is Murder thing. I always thought it was quite admirable that she would eat crap & change her lifestyle to avoid causing pain/suffering to animals but then she was a Lovely person There were days when i didn't eat meat for a couple of days but i Always had to eat meat on the 3rd day, She Never once lectured me on what to eat & i Never commented negatively on her lifestyle choice. Her passion for things was what made her Special, In the world, in her group & with me __________________

23-02-2008, 11:36	#16
Muban Shoes, Boobs & Corsets Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: The fastest town in Scotland Posts: 1,882	I'm not really sure what there is to 'get'? People have different levels of what they will or choose to eat, right from people who will eat anything (literally) to people who are vegetarian or vegan. I eat quite a range of food, including most meats and though I understand the (many differing) reasons for why people choose not to eat meat or animal products I don't think that is a choice I will ever make. It is something I have thought about as I do have consideration for what I put into my body. For example I wouldnt ever have Foie Gras, for me personally it crosses a line but if anyone else wants to eat it I am ok with it. I have many vegan and vegetarian products in my kitchen, of course I get them as they taste nice, provide variety to my diet or in some cases provide an alternative to things I choose not to eat. In fact if someone made an 'alternative' Fois Gras I woudl try it as I have heard it tastes amazing. I'm quite happy to make vegetarian or vegan meals for freinds (in fact quite often I make them for myself without realising ). Well made food with quality ingredients tastes good no matter what in my opinion. I occasionally use 'alternative' products, why not is just a different flavour? Hmmm I feel I have rambled on a bit there I can understand why this thread could offend though, I know if someone referred to what I ate as crap and that I should be a real omnivore it would **** me off. __________________ well, not to put a too fine point to it, he was discovered.. in the lounge

23-02-2008, 11:39	#17
Will BBx woz 'ere :P Join Date: Jan 1970 Posts: 2,147,487,208	I think we should bring back hinting for food. I reckon a lot of people would become vegetarian then I agree that some foods are prepared in disgraceful ways, such as foie gras - however, I will still eat it because I do very much like it. I have no justification other than it's really really nice and I enjoy it. For that I do put my hand up it is cruel and I have no defence for myself. It won't stop me though I'm afraid - I've seen them force feed geese and whilst it's a bit horrid, I can't stop thinking about the end result. I've been up to my elbows in entrails when I did some work at a butchers/slaughter houses. It didn't phase me because to me it came across as totally natural - I even found it mildly poetic and beautiful that such an animal can provide so much nutrition for so many people. In a way it would be great if meat could be spared for the people who know about food and appreciate food - but that brings in horrible elitism which our society has enough of now. I wish meats went to butchers and not to supermarkets and weren't mass produced I really really do believe this. However in this country and the western modern world it just won't happen. I'd love to boycott every mass produced item, but I'm afraid in this world it's just not possible, certainly not when I very much need meat as part of my diet. __________________ *No No!*

23-02-2008, 11:46	#20
goldilocks Abandoned Ship Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 335	oooh too many people to reply to! in response to the comments I made about Jonnys idea for a veggie thread - i thought he meant a vegetarian recipe thread - not a debating thread. my point was that although i can't 'learn' anything from a '10 things to do with your steak' thread - everyone can benefit from a ' how to make vegetables interesting' discussion there are plenty of tasty ways for meat eaters to incorporate vege alternatives into their diets - but it doesn't really work the other way around! as for the issue about guilt tripping - emotive language is only used because it is how i feel about the issue, if you started a thread on Catholicism (?!omg) i'd probably be as vocal. :/ i wouldn't eat animals, even if we reared them ourselves, because for me - bringing up a 'family' couldn't end with me eating them as Jasper has said, eating meat is not a necessity - no mater how well reared and cared for the animals were - i don't think i could bring myself to eat them. like it's been mentioned - the fact that we are so taken away from the process of animal rearing / slaughter is one of the reasons so many people haven't gone veggie - i'm sure if we had to ring our own chickens neck - it might but a few more souls off! i was not brought up vegetarian - i ate meat until i was about 10. my parents, grandma and brother all eat meat, Jasper ate meat when we started dating - and continued to do so for about a year after we met (i didn't coerce him into stopping - it was his decision, honest!) i can't ever imagine going back to eating meat, not even after a reasoned and considered debate! Last edited by goldilocks; 23-02-2008 at 11:53.

23-02-2008, 11:33	#13
FakeSnake Absinthe Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Devonshire Posts: 1,143	If your (GL & Jasp) choice of food lifestyle is because of the ethics of how animals are brought up, what do you feel about proper farm reared meat? While we do buy and eat some 'mass produced' meat from the supermarkets, a lot of our meat comes from a farm about 4 miles from my house, directly from the farm shop. I know how his animals are reared, I can see them in the fields! if you have chosen your food lifestyle because you dont agree with killing for food, thats quite a different argument.