Thoughts on Suicide

[cleanbluesky]

Originally Posted by NokkonWud

I don't think you can ever say suicide, certainly not in the mainstream usage of the word is ever the right course of action. People committing suicide because they are financially insecure, or have gotten themselves into bother is not right, never is that the right cause of action - nor those who break up in relationships are are down.

Why? Not that I'm advocating suicide, but I think its very easy to **** your life up through poor financial planning and what if a person is making the same mistake over and over again in a relationship? In other words, what if the situation is literally hopeless...

[divine]

Originally Posted by PvtPyle

There are those who would argue that this isn't suicide at all, it is euthanasia - a totally separate debate with it's own considerations to take into account.

I thought a key difference between the two was that euthanasia directly involved another party?

[Gnat]

I agree with pebs.
I think it isnt something someone would make a serious attempt at, unless there seemed like no other way.

But i suppose the other side of that is, that you never know what is around the corner, and sometimes things can seem a lot better in a short space of time. But if you went through with suicide you would never find that out.
Although I suppose to be in the state of mind to be considering it, the thought of things ever being better would seem an impossibility.

[NokkonWud]

Originally Posted by cleanbluesky

Why? Not that I'm advocating suicide, but I think its very easy to **** your life up through poor financial planning and what if a person is making the same mistake over and over again in a relationship? In other words, what if the situation is literally hopeless...

Nothing is. Which is my point.
There are charities out there that aid in financial situations, not these that you see on TV, but actual charities that do the same things for free such as CCCS, so financially I don't believe can be a reason to commit suicide, which, certainly for any healthy human being is the ultimate act of selfishness towards their friends and family - especially those who have children.

I maintain that crippling illnesses, ones that are agonizingly painful and those that become a drain on family and friends are the only legitimate excuses - certainly from my point of view.

[NokkonWud]

Originally Posted by divine

I thought a key difference between the two was that euthanasia directly involved another party?

I also believe this is the case.

[Tak]

Originally Posted by NokkonWud

I maintain that crippling illnesses, ones that are agonizingly painful and those that become a drain on family and friends are the only legitimate excuses - certainly from my point of view.

So you're saying a mental illness can't be crippling? That because it is in the head it isn't painful? That someone in the depths of depression can't be seen as being a "drain" on others?

[cleanbluesky]

Originally Posted by NokkonWud

Nothing is. Which is my point.
There are charities out there that aid in financial situations, not these that you see on TV, but actual charities that do the same things for free such as CCCS, so financially I don't believe can be a reason to commit suicide, which, certainly for any healthy human being is the ultimate act of selfishness towards their friends and family - especially those who have children.

I maintain that crippling illnesses, ones that are agonizingly painful and those that become a drain on family and friends are the only legitimate excuses - certainly from my point of view.

So you say nothing is hopeless but also infer that painful and degenerative diseases could end in legitimate suicide...

Anyway, the 'charities' aren't going to pay your bills for you, and being in debt isn't a question of being depressed about debt until someone gives you a little attention then you're fine. It can quite easily be hopeless and whilst I agree that suicide is selfish I think that things can be hopeless and that the number of people who die penniless and isolated are testament to this

[Pebs]

You're simplifying things Nokkon. You're assuming that a person is rational enough to know there is a solution. It's fair to say that anyone willing to jump in front of a train or hang themselves etc is NOT rational. Often people have family etc queueing up to help but they just dont see it as an option.

CBS, I'm talking about the kids who take half a dozen contraceptive pills every weekend after too many breezers because their boyfriend told them their bum DOES look big in that, and then before the last one has gone past their throat is onto the ambulance service. There are kids that do this week in week out. Im not saying they dont have a problem, but I dont have sympathy for them like I do a genuinely suicidal person.

[cleanbluesky]

Originally Posted by Takhisis

So you're saying a mental illness can't be crippling? That because it is in the head it isn't painful? That someone in the depths of depression can't be seen as being a "drain" on others?

Someone in the depths of depression is no party, although I think thats how it works - like a test to see if the people around them value them enough to put the work in.

I'm talking in evolutionary terms here, I'm not saying depression is an act - although I've seen how depression can improve if a person is given the right attention

[cleanbluesky]

Originally Posted by Pebs

CBS, I'm talking about the kids who take half a dozen contraceptive pills every weekend after too many breezers because their boyfriend told them their bum DOES look big in that, and then before the last one has gone past their throat is onto the ambulance service. There are kids that do this week in week out. Im not saying they dont have a problem, but I dont have sympathy for them like I do a genuinely suicidal person.

That sounds a lot like a stereotype nor would I be surprised if that's something you've seen first hand through work