Xbox 360 help please - Page 3

Davey_Pitch · 26-06-2007, 16:36

Just as a final confirmation to myself I tried the 360 again today (on the off chance it was too hot), with and without the HDD, and still no joy. I can still do things with the Xbox via the joypad (open and close the tray, shut the console down), I just can't see or hear anything. Ho hum.

Desmo · 26-06-2007, 17:29

Some interesting reading here Davey... http://forums.xbox.com/1/13392007/Sh....aspx#13392007

Daz · 26-06-2007, 18:57

Those guys still have sound, but that's something freaky there :/

Davey_Pitch · 26-06-2007, 19:22

Aye, I reckon my problem is related to that, most definitely.

Just been on to Gameplay again via their online chat, and their stance is very very concrete - "we only expect things to last as long as the warranty and after that we won't do a thing". That's despite the fact that I repeatedly pointed out that the Xbox doesn't conform to contract and therefore it's their responsibility to deal with. I think before they'll accept anything I need to get some kind of proof (possibly from an engineer) that the problem I've got is an inherent one and then they have no comeback against that whatsoever.

Davey_Pitch · 26-06-2007, 20:11

This was the chat, for anyone interested. An objective view would be appreciated as I was not a happy bunny during this conversation....

Quote:

Chojin: hi there how can i help?
David: Hi. I sent an email earlier today regarding my broken Xbox, and I was wondering how long I'd have to wait for a response?
Chojin: can i ask what the fault was with the item?
David: Sure. There's no picture or sound when I switch the Xbox on, though the joypad still works. I've tried two different cables on two different TV's so I'm sure the problem is with the 360.
David: The main issue is that my 360 is a release day console and when I spoke to an advisor over the phone earlier I was told I would have to speak to Microsoft
Chojin: as a release day console the unit is out of warrantee
David: Yes I know, however the Sale of Goods Act still protects me in these circumstances
Chojin: has the console only just developed this fault?
David: Yes, last night while playing Guitar Hero 2
Chojin: unfortunately not, the sales of goods act states the console must be free from defect at the time of sale, the duration the console is expected to remain free from defects is one year as defined by Microsoft and that is covered by both ours and Microsofts warrantees. as it is past that duration unfortunately the console is no longer covered
David: Where is it defined by Microsoft? Considering I've still got a working Mega Drive I'm pretty sure I can argue that a near £400 console is expected to last a lot longer than 18 months
David: Also, considering the extremely high number of faulty Xbox 360's I doubt I'd have any trouble proving that the console is inherently faulty
Chojin: unless there is a product recall by Microsoft witch would include production dates and console serial numbers, we have to look at each individual case by itself. as you have had the console from launch without fault past the warrantee period we will not be able to offer a replacement unit. Microsoft do offer a repair option for out of warrantee consoles and i can give you a number for them if you would like
David: I'm not after a replacement unit, a repair will do fine. And the law states that my contract is with you, not Microsoft
David: I can find you the relevant bits of the SoGA if you like
Chojin: i have the link for the sales of goods act on my screen
David: Then you'll see it for yourself. I feel I can prove that the console should be expected to last longer than the 18 or so months that I've owned it. With that in mind, as there is no damage to the console that has been brought on by my own misuse, it's fair to assume the console in inherently faulty and has just chosen this particular point in time to show those faults
David: I'm sure as a gamer yourself you'd be extremely unhappy if a £400 console you bought died in less than 2 years, considering how long they're supposed to last
Chojin: unfortunately the console is expected to rune free from defect for 1 year and this is why it does have the warrantee. after that it is no longer covered.
David: Where does it say that? I've got all the literature from when I bought my 360 and I know it doesn't say it anywhere in there
David: And irrespective of that, if the product is inherently faulty then it doesn't conform to contract
David: If the product doesn't conform to contract then it's the responsibility of the seller to sort it out, not the manufacturer
Chojin: only at time of sale. there is also the reverse burden of proof acording to the sals of goods act that means that you would have to prove that the product was faulty when you received it. since you have had use of the console past the warranty period and there have been no product recalls by date or serial number by the manufacture during this time then we cant offer any out of warrantee services. the only option i can offer you would be to contact Microsoft direct for an out of warrantee repair.
David: Not only at the time of sale. The SoGA can cover the consumer for up to 6 years after the time of purchase. And of course, inherent faults won't always show up right away, some will take a very long time to show themselves. This is where the SoGA comes in to protect the consumer with our statutory rights. I believe I can prove the console was inherently faulty, which means the goods do not conform to contract, which means it is the legal obligation of Gameplay to sort it out
Chojin: no that is the time you have to make a claim
Chojin: if you look up the quick help guide for the sales of goods act on the dti's website this is covered
David: I have it in front of me. I have to show that the console failed inside what is deemed to be a reasonable amount of time. I'm pretty sure a £400 console could reasonably be expected to last a lot longer than 18 months
David: I'm also very sure a court would agree with me
David: I'm also sure that the number of people with the same problem on this thread would prove an inherent fault and not something that's just happened at random - http://forums.xbox.com/1/13392007/Sh....aspx#13392007
Chojin: the subjectivity of how long the console would be expected to last form a retail or consumers point of view i wont go in to. the console is suplied witha one year warrantee by the manufacturer and once it is past that there is no requirement for us to take action. unfortunately my above comments still stand that i can give you the number for microsoft but i cannot offer any further help.
David: No requirement for you to take action? You mean besides your legal obligations for a good that doesn't conform to contract?
Chojin: unfortunately i as i have stated above as you have had the product beyond the warrantee period offered by Microsoft and us there is no further help i can offer
Chojin: unfortunately this service is no closing as the office closed at 6pm, if you would like my name for reference it is richard
Chojin: *now
David: We're going around in circles here. I was honestly hoping for more from a company that has been nothing but fantastic to me over the past 3-4 years. If you're going to continue to ignore your legal obligations then all I can do is contact Trading Standards and Watchdog and see what they have to say
David: Can you please ask one of your supervisors to read and respond to my email as soon as they can please. I understand you have to go by what you're told but I believe in this case what you've been told is wrong.
Chojin: there is already a page on watchdogs website
Chojin: but i will forward this chat and your email on for you
David: Thanks, I appreciate that
Chojin: ok, i am sorry that i cant help further
David: It's ok, I understand the position you're in. Hopefully I can get the whole thing resolved quickly.
Chojin: bye for now
David: bye

Haly · 26-06-2007, 21:03

Sounds reasonable to me, you didn't lose your temper or anything.

Hope you manage to get it sorted :/

Davey_Pitch · 27-06-2007, 12:17

Score one for the guy who knows his rights!

Quote:

HI,

Thanks for your email.

I am sorry to hear that you have been experiencing difficulties with your
Xbox 360 Console. This console is guaranteed against manufacturing faults
with us for a period of 12 months from the date of purchase, as long as it
is presented with a valid proof of purchase. The issue in this instance is
the question of what is "reasonably durable" and subsequently we take
guidance from Microsoft on this matter. The advice received from Microsoft
is that after a 12 month period has lapsed from the date of purchase we
should refer customers to them directly. They advise that they take each
case on its own merits.

That said, we do not want any of our customers to feel undervalued and I am
happy to try and resolve this matter for you.

If you contact TCR, they offer a repair service, if you send the unit to
them for repair I am more than happy to reimburse you for any charge made by
TCR for repair.

Please visit http://www.totalconsolerepair.co.uk to arrange a repair.

Once a repair has been carried out please forward any repair receipts to me
and I will be more than happy to reimburse the costs.

I hope this is a satisfactory resolution to this problem.

Thanks

Samm

Aftersales Manager

I'll be contacting them on my break to arrange for my 360 to be fixed

Daz · 27-06-2007, 12:18

Nicely done Davey

Haly · 27-06-2007, 12:22

Excellent

Nismo · 27-06-2007, 15:34

Are 'totalconsolerepair' an authorised repair centre then? Never heard of them.

Just seems odd for a big company to be telling you to send it off to a 3rd party.

26-06-2007, 16:36	#21
Davey_Pitch I iz speshul Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Liverpool Posts: 6,296	Just as a final confirmation to myself I tried the 360 again today (on the off chance it was too hot), with and without the HDD, and still no joy. I can still do things with the Xbox via the joypad (open and close the tray, shut the console down), I just can't see or hear anything. Ho hum. __________________ Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness, that most frightens us. Your playing small does not serve the world. There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you. We are all meant to shine as children do. It's not just in some of us; it is in everyone. And as we let our own lights shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others.

26-06-2007, 17:29	#22
Desmo The Last Airbender Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Pigmopad Posts: 11,915	Some interesting reading here Davey... http://forums.xbox.com/1/13392007/Sh....aspx#13392007 __________________

26-06-2007, 18:57	#23
Daz The Stig Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Swad! Posts: 10,713	Those guys still have sound, but that's something freaky there :/ __________________ apt-get moo

26-06-2007, 19:22	#24
Davey_Pitch I iz speshul Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Liverpool Posts: 6,296	Aye, I reckon my problem is related to that, most definitely. Just been on to Gameplay again via their online chat, and their stance is very very concrete - "we only expect things to last as long as the warranty and after that we won't do a thing". That's despite the fact that I repeatedly pointed out that the Xbox doesn't conform to contract and therefore it's their responsibility to deal with. I think before they'll accept anything I need to get some kind of proof (possibly from an engineer) that the problem I've got is an inherent one and then they have no comeback against that whatsoever. __________________ Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness, that most frightens us. Your playing small does not serve the world. There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you. We are all meant to shine as children do. It's not just in some of us; it is in everyone. And as we let our own lights shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others.

26-06-2007, 21:03	#26
Haly Do you want to hide in my box? Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 14,941	Sounds reasonable to me, you didn't lose your temper or anything. Hope you manage to get it sorted :/ __________________ Halycopter

27-06-2007, 12:18	#28
Daz The Stig Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Swad! Posts: 10,713	Nicely done Davey __________________ apt-get moo

27-06-2007, 12:22	#29
Haly Do you want to hide in my box? Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 14,941	Excellent __________________ Halycopter

27-06-2007, 15:34	#30
Nismo Columbian Coffee Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 81	Are 'totalconsolerepair' an authorised repair centre then? Never heard of them. Just seems odd for a big company to be telling you to send it off to a 3rd party. __________________