Obamaramma!

[cleanbluesky]

Originally Posted by loki

Voter turnout is expected to be high. At least McCain, Obama and the American public agree that there needs to be change. What that change is, time will tell.

What we NEED is to stop hamming up the ballot and instead choose to make our own lives more productive rather than looking for a father figure with vague promises that wont be delivered.

Like Bill Hicks said, regardless of who we vote for, the government are still going to get in.

[loki]

Originally Posted by cleanbluesky

What we NEED is to stop hamming up the ballot and instead choose to make our own lives more productive rather than looking for a father figure with vague promises that wont be delivered.

Like Bill Hicks said, regardless of who we vote for, the government are still going to get in.

But we still live in a society where there are varying degrees of accountability to the government and vice versa no ?? I read your comment that we should be more self reliant and self sufficient or have I got the wrong end of the stick

[cleanbluesky]

Originally Posted by loki

But we still live in a society where there are varying degrees of accountability to the government and vice versa no ?? I read your comment that we should be more self reliant and self sufficient or have I got the wrong end of the stick

Take a step back from the social conditioning that THIS is the way it has to be, break down what we are doing and why...

Hunter S Thompson defined politics as the art of man to control his environment. Essentially, the most popular form of this is in organising a heirarchy of who decides how society is run, and in America this is decided by a voting system that is often explained as democracy, as a misnomer. Basically, an individual is presented with a bargain - the idea that a president will make their environment better in a way that the individual cannot - and that he requires political power through the vote. The vote is not democracy, democracy as a word is vague at best and meaningless at worst - if a person wishes to improve their environment then they should do so rather than wait for others to lead them there. Your vote is not your voice, you can choose to express your political aspirations in any way you choose, and there are many ways to support a candidate or even seek election. But it is always important to remember that regardless of who is in power, it will be up to the citizens to improve their environment.

The problem is that humans tend to believe that this is an either/or dilemma. We have a limited amount of mental energy and all the energy spent hoping that someone else will make the world better means energy that WONT be spent seeking to improve things ourselves.

[loki]

Originally Posted by cleanbluesky

Take a step back from the social conditioning that THIS is the way it has to be, break down what we are doing and why...

Hunter S Thompson defined politics as the art of man to control his environment. Essentially, the most popular form of this is in organising a heirarchy of who decides how society is run, and in America this is decided by a voting system that is often explained as democracy, as a misnomer. Basically, an individual is presented with a bargain - the idea that a president will make their environment better in a way that the individual cannot - and that he requires political power through the vote. The vote is not democracy, democracy as a word is vague at best and meaningless at worst - if a person wishes to improve their environment then they should do so rather than wait for others to lead them there. Your vote is not your voice, you can choose to express your political aspirations in any way you choose, and there are many ways to support a candidate or even seek election. But it is always important to remember that regardless of who is in power, it will be up to the citizens to improve their environment.

The problem is that humans tend to believe that this is an either/or dilemma. We have a limited amount of mental energy and all the energy spent hoping that someone else will make the world better means energy that WONT be spent seeking to improve things ourselves.

I can see the message he is trying to make. That said I suspect the vast majority within our respective nations neither have the skills or the aspiration to improve their lot in life significantly. I mean this in very broad terms of not being reliant on state or nation.

Political systems have been with us since the birth of civilization, all with varying degrees of control and power. We are to a certain degree indoctrinated into valuing our vote.

[Mel]

It's election day! I've got my sample ballot and I am going to go to my polling place shortly. Aside from president, I am also voting on state-wide and county-wide propositions.

Perhaps the biggest one this year is prop 8, which is California basically trying to write an amendment to the California constitution that reads: "Only marriage between a man and a woman is valid or recognized in California." Which is bull crap. Can you believe they want to pass a law that takes people's rights away!?

[divine]

I hear the pro Prop 8 advertising has been basically outright lies as well, claiming that kids are being taught to 'be gay' in school from the ages of 7 etc. just on TV ads and stuff.

[Mel]

Yeah they've been saying that just by adding that one line allows schools to force kids to be taught about gay marriage. As if they're never going to hear about it either way. It's just ridiculous. I don't want to talk about it anymore! lol

So I just voted. Sorry it's blurry, but here's my ballot!!

[Haly]

Must be quite exciting
I love election coverage Been watching the BBC's stuff on it the last hour or so and no doubt will be tonight too when the main coverage is on. So fascinating. Even when I was a kid I loved it, probably initially because I was allowed to stay up late on election night but then it interested me too!

[lostkat]

Is it over yet?

[Mark]

Originally Posted by Haly

Must be quite exciting
I love election coverage Been watching the BBC's stuff on it the last hour or so and no doubt will be tonight too when the main coverage is on. So fascinating. Even when I was a kid I loved it, probably initially because I was allowed to stay up late on election night but then it interested me too!

Same, and I'll be staying up. Do you reckon the BBC will pull a swingometer out of their technical hat? Won't be the same without Peter Snow though.

Good to see a ballot, Mel. Never heard of any of the other candidates, which certainly says something about the coverage (over here, if a news programme covers one candidate in a particular election I believe they have to at least list all the others).

I'll certainly be looking up the result of Prop 8 as well.