Coffins - Page 2

Muban · 12-03-2008, 14:21

A nice cheap and plain coffin for me. Buried definitely, don't want cremated. Sort of a half/half split for my family. Me & Dad would prefer to be buried, Mum and Sister want to be cremated and we are all happy with each others decision.

Garp · 12-03-2008, 14:38

Personally I prefer cremation, and to have my ashes scattered somewhere meaningful to me. Like maybe the dunes at Formby's red squirrel reserve. I no longer need the carbon, might as well let it get back into the ecosystem

Quote:

Originally Posted by JodieG

Really? I find burials far more comforting, I'm catholic though and it's in my religion to be buried rather than cremated. I don't practice anymore but it's hard to get away from the indoctrination. Cliff's nan was cremated and I couldn't even stay in the room at the time, it was awful and cloying. I couldn't bear to be shut in that room while the coffin went behind the curtains. The thought made me feel ill.

I don't understand that viewpoint. On what basis do Catholics chose burial? All references to the afterlife and return of Christ say that we'll be in a new body.

JodieG · 12-03-2008, 15:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garp

Personally I prefer cremation, and to have my ashes scattered somewhere meaningful to me. Like maybe the dunes at Formby's red squirrel reserve. I no longer need the carbon, might as well let it get back into the ecosystem

I don't understand that viewpoint. On what basis do Catholics chose burial? All references to the afterlife and return of Christ say that we'll be in a new body.

It's not my viewpoint it's that of the catholic church. I don't really know why they believe that. I prefer a burial for my own reasons not because of what religion states, I'm not even sure what I believe anymore! From what I've read catholics don't agree with cremation for some reason, unless I dreamt it lol.

I do believe in life after death, something but I don't know what.

Lomster · 13-03-2008, 00:53

I'm catholic and didn't know that Jodie :/ I'll ask Father David on tuesday when i go and see him.

I don't want to be put in the ground to rot i want to be cremated and be spread in my Children's choice of place. or turned into a diamond would be cool lol

JodieG · 13-03-2008, 09:34

From a quick google I found this

http://www.catholiccemeterieskc.org/news_200706a.htm

Catholic point of view on cremation

The practice of cremation is increasing among Catholics at the same rate as it is among the general population. In support of this, the U.S. Bishops provide the following regulations for Catholics considering this option:

The regulations emphasize preference for the presence of the whole body at the funeral rites. However, there is recognition that cremating remains before funeral rites may be necessary and is permissible.
Cremated remains must be placed in a worthy vessel or container (an urn or small casket-like box) that dignifies handling and transport.
Final disposition of cremated remains should occur by burial or entombment in a mausoleum. Scattering on water, from the air or on the ground or keeping cremated remains in the home are not acceptable options—these do not provide the reverent disposition of remains that the Church requires.

Also a few other things that suggest preference towards burial. It seems it's more to do with the way the remains are dealt with and even after cremation they want burial. I'm still looking as I'd quite like to know why they feel this.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lomster

I'm catholic and didn't know that Jodie :/ I'll ask Father David on tuesday when i go and see him.

I don't want to be put in the ground to rot i want to be cremated and be spread in my Children's choice of place. or turned into a diamond would be cool lol

JodieG · 13-03-2008, 09:35

This is better

Christianity

In Christian countries, cremation fell out of favour with the people. The Catholic Church's discouragement of cremation stemmed from several ideas: first, that the body, as the instrument through which the sacraments are received, is itself a sacramental, a holy object; second that as an integral part of the human person, it should be disposed of in a way that honors and reverences it, and many early practices involved with disposal of dead bodies were viewed as pagan in origin or an insult to the body; third, that in imitation of Jesus Christ's burial, the body of a Christian should be buried; and fourth, that it constituted a denial of the resurrection of the body. Cremation was not forbidden because it might interfere with God's ability to resurrect the body, however; this was refuted as early as Minucius Felix, in his dialogue Octavius.

Cremation was, in fact, not forbidden in and of itself; even in Medieval Europe cremation was practised in situations where there were multitudes of corpses simultaneously present, such as after a battle, after a pestilence or famine, and where there was an imminent danger of diseases spreading from the corpses. However, earth burial or entombment remained the law unless there were circumstances that required cremation for the public good .Beginning in the Middle Ages, and even more so in the 18th Century and later, rationalists and classicists began to advocate cremation again as a statement denying the resurrection and/or the afterlife,although the pro-cremation movement more often than not took care to address and refute theological concerns about cremation in their works. Sentiment within the Catholic Church against cremation became hardened in the face of the association of cremation with "professed enemies of God". Rules were made against cremation, which were softened in the 1960s. The Catholic Church still officially prefers the traditional burial or entombment of the deceased, but cremation is now freely permitted as long as it is not done to express a refusal to believe in the resurrection of the body.

Until 1997, Catholic liturgical regulations required that cremation take place after the funeral Mass, so that, if possible, the body might be present for the Mass - the body was present as a symbol, and to receive the blessings and be the subject of prayers in which it is mentioned. Once the Mass itself was concluded, the body could be cremated and a second service could be held at the crematorium or cemetery where the ashes were to be interred just as for a body burial. The liturgical regulations now allow for a Mass with the container of ashes present, but permission of the local bishop is needed for this. The Church still specifies requirements for the reverent disposition of ashes, normally that the ashes are to be buried or entombed in an appropriate container, such as an urn (rather than scattered or preserved in the family home, although there are Catholics who do this anyway). Catholic cemeteries today regularly receive cremated remains and many have columbaria.

Protestant churches were much more welcoming of the use of cremation and at a much earlier date than the Catholic Church; pro-cremation sentiment was not unanimous among Protestants, however. The first crematoria in the Protestant countries were built in 1870s, and in 1908 the Dean and Chapter of Westminster Abbey, one of the most famous Anglican churches, required that remains be cremated for burial in the abbey's precincts. Scattering, or "strewing," is an acceptable practice in many Protestant denominations, and some churches have their own "garden of remembrance" on their grounds in which remains can be scattered. Other Christian groups also support cremation. These include the Jehovah's Witnesses.

On the other hand, some branches of Christianity still oppose cremation, including some minority Protestant groups. Most notably, the Eastern Orthodox Churches forbid cremation. Exceptions are made for circumstances where it may not be avoided (when civil authority demands it, or epidemics) or if it may be sought for good cause, but when a cremation is willfully chosen for no good cause by the one who is deceased, he or she is not permitted a funeral in the church and may also be permanently excluded from liturgical prayers for the departed. In Orthodoxy, cremation is a rejection of the dogma of the general resurrection, and as such is viewed harshly.

http://www.giftofireland.com/Religionandcremation.htm

12-03-2008, 14:21	#11
Muban Shoes, Boobs & Corsets Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: The fastest town in Scotland Posts: 1,882	A nice cheap and plain coffin for me. Buried definitely, don't want cremated. Sort of a half/half split for my family. Me & Dad would prefer to be buried, Mum and Sister want to be cremated and we are all happy with each others decision. __________________ well, not to put a too fine point to it, he was discovered.. in the lounge

13-03-2008, 00:53	#14
Lomster Custom Title Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Fay-Lom mansion Posts: 2,787	I'm catholic and didn't know that Jodie :/ I'll ask Father David on tuesday when i go and see him. I don't want to be put in the ground to rot i want to be cremated and be spread in my Children's choice of place. or turned into a diamond would be cool lol __________________

13-03-2008, 09:35	#16
JodieG Long Island Iced Tea Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Cambridge Posts: 340	This is better Christianity In Christian countries, cremation fell out of favour with the people. The Catholic Church's discouragement of cremation stemmed from several ideas: first, that the body, as the instrument through which the sacraments are received, is itself a sacramental, a holy object; second that as an integral part of the human person, it should be disposed of in a way that honors and reverences it, and many early practices involved with disposal of dead bodies were viewed as pagan in origin or an insult to the body; third, that in imitation of Jesus Christ's burial, the body of a Christian should be buried; and fourth, that it constituted a denial of the resurrection of the body. Cremation was not forbidden because it might interfere with God's ability to resurrect the body, however; this was refuted as early as Minucius Felix, in his dialogue Octavius. Cremation was, in fact, not forbidden in and of itself; even in Medieval Europe cremation was practised in situations where there were multitudes of corpses simultaneously present, such as after a battle, after a pestilence or famine, and where there was an imminent danger of diseases spreading from the corpses. However, earth burial or entombment remained the law unless there were circumstances that required cremation for the public good .Beginning in the Middle Ages, and even more so in the 18th Century and later, rationalists and classicists began to advocate cremation again as a statement denying the resurrection and/or the afterlife,although the pro-cremation movement more often than not took care to address and refute theological concerns about cremation in their works. Sentiment within the Catholic Church against cremation became hardened in the face of the association of cremation with "professed enemies of God". Rules were made against cremation, which were softened in the 1960s. The Catholic Church still officially prefers the traditional burial or entombment of the deceased, but cremation is now freely permitted as long as it is not done to express a refusal to believe in the resurrection of the body. Until 1997, Catholic liturgical regulations required that cremation take place after the funeral Mass, so that, if possible, the body might be present for the Mass - the body was present as a symbol, and to receive the blessings and be the subject of prayers in which it is mentioned. Once the Mass itself was concluded, the body could be cremated and a second service could be held at the crematorium or cemetery where the ashes were to be interred just as for a body burial. The liturgical regulations now allow for a Mass with the container of ashes present, but permission of the local bishop is needed for this. The Church still specifies requirements for the reverent disposition of ashes, normally that the ashes are to be buried or entombed in an appropriate container, such as an urn (rather than scattered or preserved in the family home, although there are Catholics who do this anyway). Catholic cemeteries today regularly receive cremated remains and many have columbaria. Protestant churches were much more welcoming of the use of cremation and at a much earlier date than the Catholic Church; pro-cremation sentiment was not unanimous among Protestants, however. The first crematoria in the Protestant countries were built in 1870s, and in 1908 the Dean and Chapter of Westminster Abbey, one of the most famous Anglican churches, required that remains be cremated for burial in the abbey's precincts. Scattering, or "strewing," is an acceptable practice in many Protestant denominations, and some churches have their own "garden of remembrance" on their grounds in which remains can be scattered. Other Christian groups also support cremation. These include the Jehovah's Witnesses. On the other hand, some branches of Christianity still oppose cremation, including some minority Protestant groups. Most notably, the Eastern Orthodox Churches forbid cremation. Exceptions are made for circumstances where it may not be avoided (when civil authority demands it, or epidemics) or if it may be sought for good cause, but when a cremation is willfully chosen for no good cause by the one who is deceased, he or she is not permitted a funeral in the church and may also be permanently excluded from liturgical prayers for the departed. In Orthodoxy, cremation is a rejection of the dogma of the general resurrection, and as such is viewed harshly. http://www.giftofireland.com/Religionandcremation.htm __________________