Justice ? - Page 2

Desmo · 23-07-2008, 13:56

Who on earth makes these decisions? I wouldn't want to take the guys life, but he should certainly never be able to walk the streets a free man again in my opinion.

Mark · 23-07-2008, 13:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by leowyatt

sorry his right to life was forfeit when he murdered that other person.

Are you sure? That smacks to me of the sort of eye for an eye revenge killing that gangs perpetrate on each other. There are valid reasons for killing another, but revenge killing isn't one of them.

As for the original case, I don't know all the circumstances and as such rely on those who do to make the right decision - and that doesn't necessarily mean the popular decision. All too often though it seems they are unable or incapable of doing that.

leowyatt · 23-07-2008, 13:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by starscream

Removing their liberty by locking them in prison until they either are reformed (after an appropriate period of punishment) or die has always suited me.

reformed?? He shot a police officer begging for his life!!!

leowyatt · 23-07-2008, 14:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark

Are you sure? That smacks to me of the sort of eye for an eye revenge killing that gangs perpetrate on each other. There are valid reasons for killing another, but revenge killing isn't one of them.

Yes Mark I'm perfectly sure. I think society is now too soft. Where is the real deterrant for what he did? Yes he'll be in prison for the next 37 years, boohoo, his life goes on. What about the police officer's family? I tell you what if someone murdered a family member or friend I'd want the bastard who did it in the ground, by my hand or someone else's I couldn't care who.

Von Smallhausen · 23-07-2008, 14:05

David Bieber was also wanted by the authorities in Florida for conspiracy to murder if I remember rightly.

We shouldn't generalise but David Bieber is not a reformable character. I am all for people's rights but the law abiding citizen should always have those rights over the criminal of Bieber's magnitude.

iCraig · 23-07-2008, 14:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by leowyatt

reformed?? He shot a police officer begging for his life!!!

It is awful and difficult to ever imagine he could be let "free" again.

It's also the liberal in me that says, "Doesn't everybody deserve the opportunity to reform?"

However I don't think many people could pull that type of turn around. People don't change to that degree, you are who you are ultimately. If you can be evil enough to brutally kill somebody begging for their life, you have got to have a very dark shade of evil running through your very core. Could somebody change that?

iCraig · 23-07-2008, 14:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by leowyatt

Yes Mark I'm perfectly sure. I think society is now too soft. Where is the real deterrant for what he did? Yes he'll be in prison for the next 37 years, boohoo, his life goes on. What about the police officer's family? I tell you what if someone murdered a family member or friend I'd want the bastard who did it in the ground, by my hand or someone else's I couldn't care who.

Does his life go on though? He's alive yes, but he's not free like you and I. Even if he's on a cushy wing of prison, he'll still be a million miles away from true freedom that we have each and every day.

leowyatt · 23-07-2008, 14:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by iCraig

Does his life go on though? He's alive yes, but he's not free like you and I. Even if he's on a cushy wing of prison, he'll still be a million miles away from true freedom that we have each and every day.

Yes his life goes on, it may not be to the same standard as you or me but he is still alive. If he gets his sentence reduced to 37 does he have the possibility or parole? If so he could be out sooner than that.

I personally think it all comes down to what people deem the value or a human life.

Rich_L · 23-07-2008, 14:13

Quote:

You can shoot a police officer dead, shoot two others then argue that a whole life term is contravening article 3 of the Human Rights Act on degrading and inhuman punishment ? I despair.

I would just say that the HRA argument was actually rejected, the reduction was on the basis of the facts of the case alone.

It's a weird one really, 37 years minimum is a bloody long time, and although there's a chance of release the guy will be 75 years old (if he survives that long) even if he is deemed safe to return to the community. I don't quite get the rationale though, what sort of life will this guy lead in 'normal' society having been institutionalised for that period of time - a distinctly miserable and isolated one I would imagine which begs the question what is the point in even letting him out.

Chuckles · 23-07-2008, 14:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by leowyatt

reformed?? He shot a police officer begging for his life!!!

Regardless of his actions now, you can't possibly know whether 40 years down the line he could possibly be reformed or not.

23-07-2008, 13:56	#11
Desmo The Last Airbender Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Pigmopad Posts: 11,915	Who on earth makes these decisions? I wouldn't want to take the guys life, but he should certainly never be able to walk the streets a free man again in my opinion. __________________

23-07-2008, 14:05	#15
Von Smallhausen I'm Free Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Tyneside Posts: 3,061	David Bieber was also wanted by the authorities in Florida for conspiracy to murder if I remember rightly. We shouldn't generalise but David Bieber is not a reformable character. I am all for people's rights but the law abiding citizen should always have those rights over the criminal of Bieber's magnitude. __________________ " Well, old bean, life is really so bloody awful that I feel it’s my absolute duty to be chirpy and try and make everybody else happy too." David Niven, 1910-1983.