Cannon Fodder

Matblack · 06-02-2007, 11:13

You're average soldier just can't win can they?

http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2-2007060131,00.html

You are a pilot who suspects the target you have been designated is a friendly, what do you do, you could refuse to fire on it and get crucified by your superiors and possibly court marshalled or you can pull the trigger and possibly get court marshalled for a blue on blue incident. Surely this can't be right, the person who called the target has to be to blame or its put down as an honest mistake.

I'm not sure what the upshot of this incident was whether there was any action taken against anyone but one thing is for sure it highlights the lack of communication between coilliation forces and reinforces that this sort of conflict should be handled by a single command system not joint commands. Not that we should be there at all but surely if we are there we should be talking to our allies.

Stupid stupid stupid!

MB

Justsomebloke · 06-02-2007, 13:07

Hardly the first time is it though.
The Yanks love to shoot friendlys even there own, they will even open up on a wooden house with American kids and women in it and that is on there own soil against there own countrymen.
I hate how trigger happy they are and how they always seem to get away with it.
In my opinion if there is any doubt at all then Don't fire. The vehicles they shot up were not even attacking anything ffs. What is clear to me is that Yank jets are flying around shooting the bejesus out of anything that moves.
It is really hard to remain friendly towards the yanks when they shoot our dudes and shoot there own women and kids.

killerkebab · 06-02-2007, 16:25

Are intelligence personnel held accountable for bad intel in situations like these at all?

Darrin · 06-02-2007, 23:15

Looks like whoever Manilla Hotel is (Marine ATC) is the one that's screwed.
He gave under confidence an all clear to friendlies.

The pilots (IMO) are completely blameless here.
They did thier job, they did it well. It's thier ATC's and thier intel that screwed the pooch there.

Robert · 07-02-2007, 15:36

I love how The Sun's labelling the pilot. I wish The Sun would just shutup shop and FO.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solider's Wife

We showed Matty’s widow Susan the video of the attack, and she said: “Finally I am seeing my husband die at the hands of two imbeciles.” She added: “I am really grateful to The Sun for exposing this.

Wow...that's great. Bigup the sun!

Darrin · 08-02-2007, 00:48

http://forums.ove*************.uk/sh...php?t=17689471

I think I'm about done over there.

Mark · 08-02-2007, 01:01

Shackley is a first-rate troll, and dirtydog isn't a whiter-than-white character either.

I don't know about the involvement of UK ATCs in that situation, but otherwise you are of course factually correct. Unfortunately they have a very long history of USA-bashing on that forum.

Justsomebloke · 08-02-2007, 02:03

I never posted in that thread but did post the above.
In my defence i had just watched the documentary about WACO and the branch Davidians.
No excuse though i would like to apologise to Mickey D our friendly Yankee BD member and hope he doesn't take any personal offence from my uneducated outburst/outbursts.
I have nothing against individual Americans at all or any other country it is just nice for us English to have a moan about something, we like to moan.
On a side note i had a lovely telephone conversation with this Yankee women who rang me from the states today, business of course but you can't help flirting a bit can you even if it is down the phone.

Anyways Sorry Mate

ps.
Whose gonna come and tell me i got his name wrong then ? Damn my borked memory

Darrin · 08-02-2007, 02:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pikey

Who's gonna come and tell me i got his name wrong then ? Damn my borked memory

No worries mate. No apologies necessary. And you got my name correct, too!!

Darrin · 08-02-2007, 04:05

Hee, hee, hee!!!

http://forums.ove*************.uk/sh...0&postcount=73

06-02-2007, 11:13	#1
Matblack Baby Bore Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Svalbard Posts: 9,770	Cannon Fodder You're average soldier just can't win can they? http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2-2007060131,00.html You are a pilot who suspects the target you have been designated is a friendly, what do you do, you could refuse to fire on it and get crucified by your superiors and possibly court marshalled or you can pull the trigger and possibly get court marshalled for a blue on blue incident. Surely this can't be right, the person who called the target has to be to blame or its put down as an honest mistake. I'm not sure what the upshot of this incident was whether there was any action taken against anyone but one thing is for sure it highlights the lack of communication between coilliation forces and reinforces that this sort of conflict should be handled by a single command system not joint commands. Not that we should be there at all but surely if we are there we should be talking to our allies. Stupid stupid stupid! MB __________________ "we had roots that grew towards each other underground, and when all the pretty blossom had fallen from our branches we found that we were one tree and not two"

06-02-2007, 13:07	#2
Justsomebloke The Night Worker Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 5,228	Hardly the first time is it though. The Yanks love to shoot friendlys even there own, they will even open up on a wooden house with American kids and women in it and that is on there own soil against there own countrymen. I hate how trigger happy they are and how they always seem to get away with it. In my opinion if there is any doubt at all then Don't fire. The vehicles they shot up were not even attacking anything ffs. What is clear to me is that Yank jets are flying around shooting the bejesus out of anything that moves. It is really hard to remain friendly towards the yanks when they shoot our dudes and shoot there own women and kids. __________________

06-02-2007, 16:25	#3
killerkebab Vodka Martini Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Bristol/Reading Posts: 656	Are intelligence personnel held accountable for bad intel in situations like these at all? __________________

06-02-2007, 23:15	#4
Darrin Dirteh Kitteh Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Hiding out in Mormon Country Posts: 1,629	Looks like whoever Manilla Hotel is (Marine ATC) is the one that's screwed. He gave under confidence an all clear to friendlies. The pilots (IMO) are completely blameless here. They did thier job, they did it well. It's thier ATC's and thier intel that screwed the pooch there. __________________ A bullet may have your name on it, but shrapnel is addressed "to whom it may concern".

08-02-2007, 00:48	#6
Darrin Dirteh Kitteh Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Hiding out in Mormon Country Posts: 1,629	http://forums.ove*************.uk/sh...php?t=17689471 I think I'm about done over there. __________________ A bullet may have your name on it, but shrapnel is addressed "to whom it may concern".

08-02-2007, 01:01	#7
Mark Screaming Orgasm Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Newbury Posts: 15,194	Shackley is a first-rate troll, and dirtydog isn't a whiter-than-white character either. I don't know about the involvement of UK ATCs in that situation, but otherwise you are of course factually correct. Unfortunately they have a very long history of USA-bashing on that forum.

08-02-2007, 02:03	#8
Justsomebloke The Night Worker Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 5,228	I never posted in that thread but did post the above. In my defence i had just watched the documentary about WACO and the branch Davidians. No excuse though i would like to apologise to Mickey D our friendly Yankee BD member and hope he doesn't take any personal offence from my uneducated outburst/outbursts. I have nothing against individual Americans at all or any other country it is just nice for us English to have a moan about something, we like to moan. On a side note i had a lovely telephone conversation with this Yankee women who rang me from the states today, business of course but you can't help flirting a bit can you even if it is down the phone. Anyways Sorry Mate ps. Whose gonna come and tell me i got his name wrong then ? Damn my borked memory __________________ Last edited by Justsomebloke; 08-02-2007 at 02:05.

08-02-2007, 04:05	#10
Darrin Dirteh Kitteh Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Hiding out in Mormon Country Posts: 1,629	Hee, hee, hee!!! http://forums.ove*************.uk/sh...0&postcount=73 __________________ A bullet may have your name on it, but shrapnel is addressed "to whom it may concern".