Thoughts on Suicide

loki · 25-09-2008, 07:26

I watched a documentary/film last night called The Bridge Essentially it's about the Golden Gate Bridge being the suicide hot spot of the world. It followed the lives of about 10 individuals and the events that lead upto their suicide and how it effected their families. In as much as the suicide was sudden, all of the people concerned had prepared their families for a long time for the eventual day. The sad thing is that these people had no contrast in their life. They didn't see the world as full of colour and experience. Everything was a black and torturous experience. One girl for example was schizophrenic and before her death told her family it was like having a conversation with 20 or 30 people at a time and for her she wanted some peace as the drugs didn't work.

It goes without saying that some of these peoples families will be tortured for the rest of their days as they take responsibility for the death of their friend or loved one. Personally I have never contemplated suicide but I have seen at least close friend come close. I am also aware that my Mother and Mother in Law also attempted it when myself and Sarah were very young due to the very abusive relationships they were in. Sociologically we can expect the suicide rate to go up over the course of the next few years as social unrest and economic uncertainty continues.

Can there ever be a case where suicide can be justified if that is the right word.

cleanbluesky · 25-09-2008, 10:34

I think suicide is linked in with depression - I think depression is designed to get an individual to withdraw from society, the problem being that if they don't then move into another social environment and OR be brought back into the same one by the people they knew - then they're likely to commit suicide. Isolation is one of the predictors of suicide and that doesn't mean that a isolated person has no contact with people, it means that they don't get the right type of contact. From my experience, a lot of people with depression withdraw - and there is also a worrying trend whereby depression is seen as an unexplainable vacation that the individual doesn't have control over.

Jingo · 25-09-2008, 10:59

It's a very sensitive issue that often sparks volatile debate.

It is very easy to adopt an ignorant opinion towards the subject- thrashing out and calling those who take their own lives selfish and unthoughtful: a younger and less rational me used to think in this way.

Yet after having some direct relationships with suicides, attempted suicides and depression ranging from mild to manic/bipolar I have been educated in just how very deep and severely complex this subject can get.

I have a feeling that this thread may well progress into a debate that I will find too distressing to continue taking part in, however I thought I would at least chip in with my brief thoughts

NB - If anyone reading this page is feeling on a low and needs some un-patronising and genuinely helpful advice then I can thoroughly recommend the Samaritans: 08457 90 90 90... Ignore your pre-conceptions of this organisation, they are a progressive and excellent source of support for those who need it most.

Pebs · 25-09-2008, 11:22

I don't think anyone is really qualified to judge someone who is truly suicidal unless they've been there, really truly been there. I'm not talking about the 15yr old girl who take 6 paracetamol and then phones all her mates to tell them (the bain of the ambulance services bloody lives). I mean the people that genuinely believe that either they or the people around them will be better off if they kill themselves.

I don't think it's a selfish act. It's an act bourne out of utter desolate desperation and I can only have sympathy for people who are that low. I can see how people would think it selfish, and to those they leave behind I can imagine it must be impossible to see it any other way, thay have left them behind to deal with the fallout, they have cause all this pain etc. Rightly or wrongly I see that as a by-product of one persons suffering

cleanbluesky · 25-09-2008, 11:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by James

NB - If anyone reading this page is feeling on a low and needs some un-patronising and genuinely helpful advice then I can thoroughly recommend the Samaritans: 08457 90 90 90... Ignore your pre-conceptions of this organisation, they are a progressive and excellent source of support for those who need it most.

I went through training for them and I disagree, but they are excellent for phoning up and talking to - I wouldn't call them support.

cleanbluesky · 25-09-2008, 11:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pebs

I don't think anyone is really qualified to judge someone who is truly suicidal unless they've been there, really truly been there. I'm not talking about the 15yr old girl who take 6 paracetamol and then phones all her mates to tell them (the bain of the ambulance services bloody lives). I mean the people that genuinely believe that either they or the people around them will be better off if they kill themselves.

I'm not sure there is a difference - I think every suicidee would like to be rescued but some are more hopeful than others.

Pebs · 25-09-2008, 12:24

I'm not sure I agree. One is asking for attention, one is looking for a way out.

cleanbluesky · 25-09-2008, 12:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pebs

I'm not sure I agree. One is asking for attention, one is looking for a way out.

Why do you think one is after attention? I knew a guy who set up a plan where he could be rescued by sending letters telling people when and where he was going to commit suicide - the problem being that the letters got caught in a postal strike, hence he went through with it.

I think that people want to be saved from suicide, therefore I don't think there is a 'cry for help', just people who are optimistic that they will be rescued. If they're not, I think they'll just go through with it.

NokkonWud · 25-09-2008, 12:43

I don't think you can ever say suicide, certainly not in the mainstream usage of the word is ever the right course of action. People committing suicide because they are financially insecure, or have gotten themselves into bother is not right, never is that the right cause of action - nor those who break up in relationships are are down.

The only time I can ever understand it is if the suicide is merely a case of putting to rest illness such as people riddled with cancer or crippling physical illnesses, in those instances I can fully understand it.

PvtPyle · 25-09-2008, 15:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by NokkonWud

The only time I can ever understand it is if the suicide is merely a case of putting to rest illness such as people riddled with cancer or crippling physical illnesses, in those instances I can fully understand it.

There are those who would argue that this isn't suicide at all, it is euthanasia - a totally separate debate with it's own considerations to take into account.

25-09-2008, 07:26	#1
loki Vodka Martini Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Manchester UK Posts: 871	Thoughts on Suicide I watched a documentary/film last night called The Bridge Essentially it's about the Golden Gate Bridge being the suicide hot spot of the world. It followed the lives of about 10 individuals and the events that lead upto their suicide and how it effected their families. In as much as the suicide was sudden, all of the people concerned had prepared their families for a long time for the eventual day. The sad thing is that these people had no contrast in their life. They didn't see the world as full of colour and experience. Everything was a black and torturous experience. One girl for example was schizophrenic and before her death told her family it was like having a conversation with 20 or 30 people at a time and for her she wanted some peace as the drugs didn't work. It goes without saying that some of these peoples families will be tortured for the rest of their days as they take responsibility for the death of their friend or loved one. Personally I have never contemplated suicide but I have seen at least close friend come close. I am also aware that my Mother and Mother in Law also attempted it when myself and Sarah were very young due to the very abusive relationships they were in. Sociologically we can expect the suicide rate to go up over the course of the next few years as social unrest and economic uncertainty continues. Can there ever be a case where suicide can be justified if that is the right word. __________________ PC & Console LAN 9th-11th July

25-09-2008, 10:59	#3
Jingo Smother me in chocolate and eat flapjacks with it! Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: North Somerset Posts: 1,854	It's a very sensitive issue that often sparks volatile debate. It is very easy to adopt an ignorant opinion towards the subject- thrashing out and calling those who take their own lives selfish and unthoughtful: a younger and less rational me used to think in this way. Yet after having some direct relationships with suicides, attempted suicides and depression ranging from mild to manic/bipolar I have been educated in just how very deep and severely complex this subject can get. I have a feeling that this thread may well progress into a debate that I will find too distressing to continue taking part in, however I thought I would at least chip in with my brief thoughts NB - If anyone reading this page is feeling on a low and needs some un-patronising and genuinely helpful advice then I can thoroughly recommend the Samaritans: 08457 90 90 90... Ignore your pre-conceptions of this organisation, they are a progressive and excellent source of support for those who need it most. __________________

25-09-2008, 11:22	#4
Pebs Easymouth Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 6,716	I don't think anyone is really qualified to judge someone who is truly suicidal unless they've been there, really truly been there. I'm not talking about the 15yr old girl who take 6 paracetamol and then phones all her mates to tell them (the bain of the ambulance services bloody lives). I mean the people that genuinely believe that either they or the people around them will be better off if they kill themselves. I don't think it's a selfish act. It's an act bourne out of utter desolate desperation and I can only have sympathy for people who are that low. I can see how people would think it selfish, and to those they leave behind I can imagine it must be impossible to see it any other way, thay have left them behind to deal with the fallout, they have cause all this pain etc. Rightly or wrongly I see that as a by-product of one persons suffering __________________ ...faster you naughty little monkey! Running through hell, heaven can wait!

25-09-2008, 12:24	#7
Pebs Easymouth Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 6,716	I'm not sure I agree. One is asking for attention, one is looking for a way out. __________________ ...faster you naughty little monkey! Running through hell, heaven can wait!

25-09-2008, 12:43	#9
NokkonWud BD Recruitment Officer Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Smogville Posts: 3,880	I don't think you can ever say suicide, certainly not in the mainstream usage of the word is ever the right course of action. People committing suicide because they are financially insecure, or have gotten themselves into bother is not right, never is that the right cause of action - nor those who break up in relationships are are down. The only time I can ever understand it is if the suicide is merely a case of putting to rest illness such as people riddled with cancer or crippling physical illnesses, in those instances I can fully understand it. __________________

25-09-2008, 10:34	#2
cleanbluesky Abandoned Ship Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 492	I think suicide is linked in with depression - I think depression is designed to get an individual to withdraw from society, the problem being that if they don't then move into another social environment and OR be brought back into the same one by the people they knew - then they're likely to commit suicide. Isolation is one of the predictors of suicide and that doesn't mean that a isolated person has no contact with people, it means that they don't get the right type of contact. From my experience, a lot of people with depression withdraw - and there is also a worrying trend whereby depression is seen as an unexplainable vacation that the individual doesn't have control over.